[Historic Review Commission]
[00:00:04]
AT. TIME, I'D LIKE TO CALL TO ORDER THE WALLY HISTORIC REVIEW COMMISSION REGULAR MEETING FOR OCTOBER 26TH. 2023 IT IS. SIX O'CLOCK. AT THIS TIME. ALISON, WILL YOU DO THE.
AT THIS TIME IF THERE'S ANYONE THAT HAS ANY COMMENTS ON NON AGENDA, ADAMS ADAMS. SOMEONE IN THE CROWD. THERE'S NO ONE UP HERE. ALL RIGHT, WE'LL GO ON. PRESENTATIONS. WE'LL GO ON TO THE CONSENT AGENDA. THE. ADAM A MEETING MEETING MINUTES FROM SEPTEMBER 28 2023 REGULAR MEETING. DO WE HAVE ANY DISCUSSION? CHANGES TO THOSE MINUTES. HMM. NO CHANGES ARE ENTERTAIN A MOTION. PROVE THEM. I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE MINUTES I SECOND. CAKE IF YOU'RE CAST YOUR BONE. MOTION PASSED. 70. WE'LL MOVE ON TO THE REGULAR AGENDA. ADAM ONE, CONSIDERING ACTIVE ON A RECOMMENDATION TO THE CITY COUNCIL REGARDING THE DEMOLITION OF OUR COMMERCIAL STRUCTURE IN ACCORDANCE WITH ORDINANCE NUMBER, 20 22-34. PROPERTY LOCATED AT 104, SOUTH BALLARD WITHIN THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT. OKAY, YES. MADAM CHAIRMAN AND MEMBERS OF THE BOARD. SO THIS IS A REQUEST BY THE WILY ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION TO DEMOLISH AN EXISTING 1885 SQUARE FOOT COMMERCIAL BUILDING. UM, THE E.
D. C. PURCHASE THIS PROPERTY IN 2022. UM, SOME OF THE HISTORY ON IT, UM LILLIAN, CAN YOU ECHO IS OH, IF PEOPLE CAN SHE CAN CAN SHE CONTROL IT FROM THIS PAD? YEAH. OH, NO. OKAY, I'LL GO DOWN HERE THEN.
WELL, OF COURSE NOT. OH, OKAY? SO AGAIN. THIS DOWN. OKAY? ALL RIGHT. SO AGAIN. THIS IS.
SORRY ABOUT THAT. SO FOR THOSE OF YOU THAT MAY OR MAY NOT BE FAMILIAR WITH THIS BUILDING.
THIS IS THE CORNER OF BALLARD AND OAK. SOME OF THE PREVIOUS USES IN THE PAST HAVE BEEN A PAWNSHOP FITNESS STUDIO BEAUTY. AND BARBERSHOP. NUTRITION UM, A FRUIT STORE. WHICH IS THE CURRENT USER. UM AND THEY WILL VACATE THE PROPERTY AT THE END OF THIS MONTH. THE REQUEST FROM THE DC IS TO DEMOLISH THIS BILL. IT IS IT'S NOT BECAUSE THE STRUCTURAL DAMAGE OR FALLING
[00:05:03]
APART, DILAPIDATED OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT IT IS SIMPLY FOR REDEVELOPMENT OF THE AREA, WHICH IS ONE OF THE REASONS THE PURCHASED THE BUILDING IN 2022. UM RACHEL HERMES IS HERE REPRESENTING THE E. D. C THAT CAN ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE, OR I'LL BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANYTHING THAT I CAN UM IF APPROVED, THE BUILDING WILL BE DEMOLISHED. UM, BEGINNING OF DECEMBER. UM, WITH. PROBABLY COMPLETELY DOWN BY THE END OF DECEMBER. UM AGAIN. THERE IS NO ENGINEERING REPORT ATTACHED TO THIS ONE OR THE OTHER TWO BECAUSE NONE OF THOSE THE REQUESTS HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH UH UM, DECAY OR DILAPIDATION OR ANYTHING STRUCTURALLY OF THE PROPERTIES. SO WITH THAT, I'LL BE HAPPY TO ANSWERING QUESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE AGAIN. RACHEL IS HERE TO ALSO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS THAT YOU MAY HAVE. I KNOW THIS IS A QUESTION ABOUT THE FUTURE. DO WE KNOW WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT PUTTING IN THERE ONCE THAT ONE THAT ONE'S GONE. I KNOW IT'S FOR FUTURE USE . BUT DO WE HAVE ANY IDEAS OF WHAT IT MIGHT BE? HI RACHEL HERMANN'S WILEY, ABC. AT THIS POINT, THERE ARE NO FIRM PLANS. UH THE BOARD HAS MOVED TO TRY TO MARKET THE PROPERTIES THAT WE DO HAVE AVAILABLE, SO THE FIRST STEP WOULD BE TO FOR THE PROPERTIES THAT WE HAVE TENANTS IN. TWO. YOU KNOW, GO THROUGH THE PROCESS OF THEM. GETTING OUT OF THE BUILDINGS AND THEN WE'LL LOOK AT DEMOLISHING, WHICH IS WHERE WE'RE AT NOW AND THEN WE'LL LOOK AT MARKETING THE PROPERTIES AND SEE WHAT THE OPPORTUNITIES ARE UNDERSTANDING THAT THIS IS A PRIME PROPERTY, AND WE DO WORK CLOSELY WITH THE CITY. UM OUR BOARD STAFF. WE ALL WORK TOGETHER WITH THE CITY TO MAKE SURE THAT WHATEVER WE DO BRING IS AN ASSET TO THE COMMUNITY IN HIGHLIGHTS THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT SO WHAT IT IS, HE DOES. EDUCATE ME A LITTLE BIT IS THAT THEY WILL THEN LOOK TO EITHER SELL THIS PROPERTY TO SOMEONE WHO WANTS TO REDEVELOP IT, OR THEY WILL REDEVELOP IT FOR FUTURE USE. IT COULD BE EITHER. BUT WE WILL BE HEAVILY INVOLVED ARE BOARD ALONG WITH COUNCIL AS WELL BECAUSE IT ALL REQUIRES OVERSIGHT BY BY THEM, AS WELL AS PLANNING AND EVERYTHING THAT'S PUT IN PLACE IN THE WORK THAT YOU GUYS DO AS WELL TO MAKE SURE THAT IT COMPLIES WITH ALL THE REQUIREMENTS. ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? JUST KIND OF TO ADD A LITTLE BIT MORE TO WHAT RACHEL SAID. I THINK KIND OF HOPEFULLY TO HAVE A CLEAR UNDERSTANDING. SOMETIMES IT'S A GOOD THING THAT THE NDC WILL GO IN AND PURCHASED THE PROPERTIES BECAUSE OF THE WORKING RELATIONSHIP THAT THE A D C HAS WITH THE CITY, THEN THEY CAN BETTER CONTROL OF WHO OWNS IT IN THE FUTURE, AS OPPOSED TO SAY IF THEY DIDN'T ON THIS PROPERTY. AND JUST SOME RANDOM DEVELOPER WHO REALLY HAD NO TIES, OR, UM INVESTMENT IN WYLIE PURCHASED IT. YEAH WE COULD CONTROL WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE AND, YOU KNOW, PUT THE ORDINANCE SAYS , BUT YOU DON'T CONTROL IT AS MUCH AS WITH HAVING THE E D. C INVOLVED. AND THAT'S WHY I WANTED NOT JUST MYSELF, BUT THE REST OF THE COMMISSIONERS TO HAVE A LITTLE BIT MORE UNDERSTANDING ABOUT THE BBC. AND HOW THAT WORKS. SOMEBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, COMMENTS? UM I HAVE A QUICK QUESTION. SO THE PROPERTY ON BALLARD THAT HAS MURAL ON THE SIDE, SO I KNOW THAT HAD TO COME THROUGH. APPROVAL THROUGH KIND OF THE ARTS COMMISSION. CRAIG SO, ARE THERE ANY CONCERNS WITH NOW KIND OF REMOVING THAT SINCE THE BUILDING WILL BE GONE? NO. AND THAT IS THIS BUILDING. WELL IT'S KIND OF TURNS ALWAYS. BUT YES SO WHEN THAT MORE MURAL WAS PRETTY IN OR DESIGNED THE ARTS BORDEN EVEN EXIST. I MEAN, THAT'S WAY WAY PAST. DO WE KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE HISTORY OF THAT MURAL WHEN IT WENT IN? WHO DID IT? IS THERE ANY ANY HISTORICAL SIGNIFICANCE THAT WE SAY OH, MY GOD, WE DON'T WANT TO CARRY THAT DOWN. NOT THAT I'M AWARE OF. I WANT TO SAY DAVE EDEN MAY HAVE BEEN THE ARTIST CAN I INTERJECT? OH, ROGER NETS WITH THE ARTISTS.OKAY, THANK YOU. AND THERE IS SOME HISTORICAL REPRESENTATION OF PEOPLE WHO WERE. AND LEADERSHIP AND COMMUNITY LEADERS AND SO FORTH AND WILEY AT DIFFERENT TIMES IN HISTORY. UM SO YES, THERE IS SOME HISTORICAL REPRESENTATION IN THE ART. UM AND IT WAS ROGER NETS. WHO DID THE PIECE. THANK YOU CREATED. IT WAS CREATED BEFORE I BECAME PART OF THE BOARD. UM AND IT'S BEEN
[00:10:06]
THERE FOR SO LONG. I RENEE MIGHT REMEMBER. I MEAN, I'VE BEEN HERE 19 YEARS AND IT WAS THERE BEFORE I GOT HERE. SO I GUESS MY QUESTION FROM A HISTORICAL ASPECT WOULD BE OR MY QUESTION TO POSE IS. IS THERE A POSSIBILITY THAT THE E D C IS WILLING TO WHATEVER GOES UP THERE? THIS IS CAN THIS BE CREATE RECREATED? IS THERE A NEED FOR THIS TO BE CREATED? I'M THE QUESTION PERSON, UH, YOU KNOW, I WANT TO UNDERSTAND. I WOULDN'T I DON'T KNOW THAT IT COULD BE RECREATED. AND IF IT'S RECREATED. REALLY WHAT'S THE HISTORY THERE? UM NOW COULD IT BE PHOTOGRAPHED AND MADE INTO A POSTER FRAME PICTURE SOMEWHERE. POSSIBLY I'M SURE ROGER WOULD LOVE TO BE COMMISSIONED TO DO ANOTHER PIECE. YEAH, THAT'S A THAT'S CERTAINLY ANOTHER OPTION AND THAT THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO DO. STARTED DISCUSSION ON IS THIS THIS IS SIGNIFICANT ENOUGH THAT WE WANT TO FOR SOME CONSIDERATION ON THAT. AND THAT'S UP TO YOU. UM. I'M NOT NECESSARILY JUST TIED TO THAT PIECE. BUT I DO THINK THE FACT THAT WE ARE LOSING ARTWORK.ARTWORK HAS TO HAVE SOME COMPONENT AND WE NEED TO THINK ABOUT THAT IN THE FUTURE. MAYBE OTHER PLACES ARE THIS BUILDING OR JUST SOMETHING, SO WE'RE NOT TAKING AWAY ALL OF THE ARTWORK.
SO THEM. STATUS POINT. WHAT ARE OUR OPTIONS? WHEN I AS FAR AS WELL, YOU HAVE AN ACTIVE, VERY ACTIVE ARTS BOARD. UM CAROL EHRLICH, WHO IS THE CITY'S LIAISON TO THAT BOARD. I MEAN, THEY ARE VERY ACTIVE AND THERE'S GOING TO BE MORE ART. DOWNTOWN AND ALL AROUND TOWN, SO I MEAN, I DON'T THINK YOU'RE GONNA START SEEING ART GO AWAY. BUT THEY ARE VERY, VERY ACTIVE BOARD. I'M ACTUALLY A MEMBER OF THE BOARD. AND UM, WE DO AT LEAST ONE PIECE A YEAR, SOMETIMES MORE. DEPENDS ON THE BUDGET. UM DIFFERENT THINGS. BUT. THIS IS THE ONLY MURAL ASIDE FROM THE FIRE STATION ON BROWN. THAT HAS, LIKE KIND OF A PHOTOGRAPHIC MURAL. UM ON THE PYLON. BUT, UM.
EVERYTHING ELSE THAT THE BOARD HAS EVER DONE. IS VERY INDEPENDENT OF OTHER STRUCTURES.
THIS IS PROBABLY THE OLDEST PIECE OF ART, THOUGH, THAT THE CITY HAS AND THAT'S WHAT I WAS GOING TO SAY WAS, I'M SURE THAT WE HAVE SOME RESIDENTS. BUT THIS MEANS SOMETHING TO SO THEN MY QUESTION WOULD BE CAN WE HAVE A CITY PHOTOGRAPHER? THAT SOMEONE WHO COULD MAKE SURE THAT THIS IS DOCUMENTED IN A WAY THAT WE COULD POSSIBLY TURN IT INTO? OPPOSED TO A POSTCARD. WHATEVER SO THAT IT COULD BE OFFERED TO CITIZENS THAT IT MEANT SOMETHING TO OR EVEN REPRODUCED. BY THIS ARTIST ON ANOTHER BUILDING AT SOME POINT THAT IS A DISCUSSION. I'M JUST THINKING THAT. I THINK THIS WILL HIT SOME PEOPLE IN THE WRONG WAY IF WE JUST THINK WE SHOULD JUST DESTROY IT, AND NOT BECAUSE CERTAINLY THINKING CAN BE DOCUMENTED. THAT'S FOR SURE. DOES THE ART SPORT GET TO WEIGH IN ON THIS OR WANT TO WEIGH IN ON THIS? NOT THAT I'M AWARE OF. JUST I'M SORRY. I DIDN'T HEAR WHAT YOU SAID. JUST WHO DOES THE ARTS BOARD GET TO WEIGH IN OR WANT TO WIN. I HAVEN'T I HAVE NOT HEARD FROM ANY OF THE BOARD MEMBERS OTHER THAN I HONESTLY DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION, BECAUSE IF YOU'RE CORRECT IN THAT THIS WAS COMMISSIONED BEFORE THE BOARD EVEN EXISTED. UM I REALLY I DON'T KNOW WHAT AUTHORITY THE ARTS. THE ARTS BOARD IS DOESN'T HAVE A LOT OF AUTHORITY THERE IN ADVISEMENT BOARD TO CITY COUNCIL. TO MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS AND TO MAKE SOME DECISIONS AND DO A LOT OF SIFTING AND LEG WORK AND FUNDRAISING. UM THAT'S HOW THE ARTIST PURCHASED THROUGH FUNDS AND THROUGH SMALL BIT OF EARMARKED TAX MONEY THAT COMES FROM THE HOTEL TAX. UM SO I DON'T REALLY KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION. WELL, THE BOARD DID THEY CONSIDERED ARTWORK ON THE NORTH SIDE OF THIS BUILDING. UM THEY WILL PARTNERING WITH THE COLLEGE WITH SOME ART STUDENTS, AND THAT KIND OF WENT BACK AND FORTH AND ULTIMATELY GOT TO COUNSEL. WAS NOT APPROVED FOR VARIOUS REASONS. ONE BEING I THINK COUNCIL KNEW THAT THERE
[00:15:06]
WERE GOING THERE WAS GOING TO BE SOME REDEVELOPMENT ON THIS PROPERTY. SO I THINK THE ART BOARD WILL HAVE SOME SAY. IN CERTAINLY THE ART THAT GOES ON GOES INTO DOWNTOWN. I WOULD SAY AS WELL THAT IF IT WAS SOMETHING THAT WAS A PRIORITY OF THE CITY, UM AND OF COURSE, YOU GUYS THROUGH THE DEVELOPMENT. I THINK OUR BOARD WOULD BE THOUGHTFUL ABOUT WHAT IS GOING IN. IT'S HARD TO SAY WHAT EXACTLY WILL BE AT THIS EXACT LOCATION, SO I CAN'T SAY THERE WILL BE A MURAL RIGHT HERE. BUT I THINK WITH OR I KNOW WITH THE DEVELOPMENT, THEY WOULD BE THOUGHTFUL AND TAKE THE INPUT AND THOUGHTS OF THE CITY AS WELL. UM AND THEY WANT TO MAINTAIN THE CHARM AND CHARACTER OF DOWNTOWN. SO IF THAT'S A COMPONENT OF IT, I DON'T SEE ANY REASON THEY WOULD BE OPPOSED TO THAT. I HAVEN'T MAYBE IF WE APPROVE DEMOLITION OF THE BUILDING IF WE COULD MAKE SURE THAT IT'S DOCUMENTED THAT MURAL IS THOROUGHLY DOCUMENTED. AH PICTORIALLY BEFORE THAT HAPPENS, SO THAT WHATEVER WE FEEL LIKE BECAUSE HOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE BEEN DRIVING INTO WHILE IN IT'S THE FIRST THING THAT CATCHES YOUR EYE AS YOU COME DOWN MAINSTREAMS YOU PAST THE PARK. SO IF WE CAN MAKE SURE IT'S DOCUMENTED WOULD YOU ALL FEEL GOOD WITH THAT? OKAY GOOD.I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION. YEAH I'M SORRY. I HAVE ONE MORE QUESTION. IT MAY NOT BE PERTINENT TO THIS PARTICULAR COMMISSION, BUT IT INVOLVES THE EC. WITH ABSENT A PLAN TO MOVE FORWARD AT THIS POINT, CAN YOU SPEAK TO THE STRATEGY OF WIDE DEMOLISHING IT NOW? OUR BOARD REALLY JUST DECIDED AS WE LOOKED AT ALL THE PROPERTIES THAT WE HAVE THAT THEY WOULD RATHER NOT BEING THE LANDLORD BUSINESS. UH HUH. AND GO AHEAD AND MARKET THE PROPERTIES THAT WE HAVE AVAILABLE SO IT'S NOT ONLY THESE , YOU GUYS ARE SAYING THREE PROPERTIES THAT WE HAVE ADDITIONAL ONES AS WELL. THAT JUST DON'T HAPPEN TO FALL IN THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT, SO IT'S JUST A DECISION THAT BOARDS MADE AS A WHOLE FOR ORGANIZATION TO MOVE TOWARDS MARKETING.
PROPERTIES. COME IN. IF NOT, I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION. I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE ITEM.
ALL SECOND. WAIT CAN WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE READ IT IN SUCH THAT WE PROVE. WITH THE CAVEAT THAT IT'S DOCUMENTED PICTORIALLY BEFORE DEMOLITION STARTS. CAN WE BE MORE SPECIFIC ABOUT HOW IT'S DOCUMENTED BEFORE WE APPROVE IT? I'M SORRY THAT PICTURES ARE TAKEN SO THAT WE HAVE IT ALL DOCUMENTED SHOULD SOMEONE WHETHER IT BE THE ARTISTS ARE OUTSIDE OF THE ARTISTS. THE ORIGINAL ARTIST WANTS TO RECREATE IT SOMEWHERE. PROVED THAT THE CITY THEN WE HAVE ENOUGH DOCUMENTATION THAT THAT'S DONE. I'M NOT SURE ANY OTHER WAY THAT IF THERE'S ANY OTHER WAY TO DO THAT, EXCEPT JUST TAKING PICTURES OF IT, BUT IT'S PRESERVED. UNLESS YOU HAVEN'T AN IDEA. TELL ME THING I COULD THINK OF OTHER THAN THAT WOULD BETTER PRESERVED THAT WALL OF THE BUILDINGS AND THAT WOULD BE VERY EXPENSIVE. YEAH. I DON'T EVEN KNOW IF THAT CAME TO BE DONE. OKAY? I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE ITEM WITH THE CAVEAT. THAT THE MURAL IS PHOTOGRAPHED. IN SUCH A WAY THAT IT COULD BE REPRODUCED ARE AT LEAST FOR POSTERITY PURPOSES.
OUR TO DO MOTION PRIOR TO DEMOLITION. ALL SECOND. OKAY, CAST YOUR VOTE.
ALRIGHT THAT MOTION CARRIES 7 TO 0. ADAM, TOO. SO EVERY NIGHT LET ME GET BACK HERE. UM, TO CONSIDER AND ACT UPON A RECOMMENDATION TO THE CITY COUNCIL REGARDING THE DEMOLITION OF A COMMERCIAL STRUCTURE IN ACCORDANCE WITH ORDINANCE NUMBER 20 22-34. PROPERTY LOCATED AT 100 EAST OAK STREET WITHIN THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT. OBVIOUSLY ACROBAT PRO IS NOT ON
[00:20:04]
THIS COMPUTER. I CAN'T TURN IT SIDEWAYS. RIGHT? SO THIS IS THE FORMALLY. BART PEDDICORD CENTER.IT. WAS WAY BEFORE MY TIME, I THINK ONE POINT A POST OFFICE. CURRENTLY THE NORTH POINT IS IT NORTH POINT? CHURCH. WALLY. NORTHEAST CHURCH HOUSES THERE. UM THE CURRENT TENANT WILL VACATE THE BUILDING. UM AT THE END OF JANUARY, 2024 AGAIN. SAME THING WITH THE PREVIOUS PROPERTY. IT'S NOT STRUCTURALLY, UM DAMAGED OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT AGAIN. GTC PURCHASED THE PROPERTY FOR REDEVELOPMENT PURPOSES. UH IF APPROVED, I THINK IN YOUR REPORT, IT SAYS THAT DEMOLITION WOULD START EARLY NOVEMBER, BUT IT WOULD ACTUALLY BE IN FEBRUARY. SO, UM WITH THAT AGAIN. RACHEL IS HERE. AND WE'LL ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE. I WAS JUST HOPING YOU WEREN'T GONNA DEMOLISHED ON TOP OF THEIR HEADS BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T GOING TO DO THAT TILL JANUARY. YEAH. COMMENT. I THINK THE ONLY CONCERN I HAD ABOUT THIS BUILDING. ALTHOUGH I DON'T THINK IT'S HISTORICALLY SIGNIFICANT IS JUST THE FACT THAT IT WAS USED AS A POST OFFICE AT ONE TIME, BUT I DON'T THINK IT WAS LIKE AN ORIGINAL POST OFFICE OR THE FIRST POST OFFICE OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. MY UNDERSTANDING IS CORRECT. UM SO. NO QUESTIONS FROM ANYBODY. NO COMMENT. IF NOT, I'LL TAKE A MOTION. TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE IS WRITTEN.
OKAY THAT ADAM APPROVED 70. AND ITEM THREE ON THE REGULAR AGENDA, CONSIDER AN ACTIVE ON AND RECOMMENDATION TO THE CITY COUNCIL REGARDING THE DEMOLITION OF A RESIDENTIAL. HORTON'S WITH ORDINANCE NUMBER 20 22-34. PROPERTY LOCATED AT 300 NORTH SECOND STREET WITHIN THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT. YES. SO THIS IS A RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURE 1814 SQUARE FEET. UM RESIDENT WILL VACATE THE PROPERTY NOVEMBER 30TH OF THIS YEAR. AGAIN NO STRUCTURAL DAMAGE OR ANYTHING. UM E. D. C HAS PURCHASED QUITE A BIT OF PROPERTY TO THE EAST, RIGHT? TO THE EAST OF THIS, UM SOME OF IT FRONTING. 78 BROWN AND THEN. ACTUALLY BACKING UP ADJACENT TO THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT AGAIN FOR REDEVELOPMENT PURPOSES. IF APPROVED, THEY ARE STATING THAT DEMOLITION WILL START IN EARLY DECEMBER. BURN I DO WE HAVE DOCUMENTATION. I KNOW THE TAX ROLLS SAY, BUT WE HAVE DOCUMENTATION THAT STATES WHAT YEAR THIS HOUSE WAS CONSTRUCTED.
THE ONLY THING THAT WE HAVE IS WHAT'S ON THE TAX ROLLS BELIEVE IT WAS 1967 IS WHAT IT SAYS. AND I DON'T KNOW. HOW ACCURATE THAT IS. DO YOU KNOW? IT'S VERY COMMON. AND ALL THEIR HOMES.
THAT WERE BUILT PRIOR TO THE SIXTIES. NOT TO BE DOCUMENTED IN THE TAX ROLLS. AS YOU KNOW, BECAUSE THERE WEREN'T GOOD RECORDS KEPT BACK THEN. THIS HOUSE LOOKS MUCH OLDER THAN THE SIXTIES TO ME. POSSIBLY I CAN'T. I MEAN, WE HAVE SOME THAT WE CAN GO AND LOOK ON COLIN CAT, AND IT WILL SAY 1950. UM I DON'T HAVE ANY OTHER HISTORY OTHER THAN WHAT'S ON THE TAX ROLLS. IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT THERE? IF AND I WAS HOPING TO GET THIS DONE, BUT I DIDN'T HAVE A CHANCE TO BEFORE THE MEETING. UM VISIT THE BIRMINGHAM TRUST AND LOOK AT THE OLD FIRE ZONES. TO SEE IF THIS HOMELESS DOCUMENTED EARLIER IN THE CENTURY. MY CONCERN IS THAT EVERY TIME THE CDC BUYS UP
[00:25:06]
A PROPERTY AND DEMOLISHES A BEFORE LONG THERE WON'T BE ANYTHING LEFT IN DOWNTOWN WILEY.THAT'S HISTORIC. IF THIS IS TRULY A HISTORIC BUILDING, WHICH IT APPEARS TO BE AT FACE VALUE.
I HAVEN'T WALKED THROUGH THE BUILDING. I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE INTERNAL FEATURES OF THE BUILDING TO MAKE A DETERMINATION AS TO THE AGE OF IT. BUT IT CONCERNS ME THAT. IF THERE'S NOTHING REALLY STRUCTURALLY STRUCTURALLY WRONG WITH THE BUILDING. THAT IT WOULD BE DEMOLISHED. JUST BECAUSE. LET ME ASK ON THAT STREET. IS IT TRUE DC, HAS BROUGHT UP EVERYTHING ON THAT WHOLE BLOCK. ON THAT SIDE OF THE STREET. PHONE EVERYTHING EXCEPT FOR ONE HOUSE ON THAT SIDE, JUST ON THAT SIDE OF SECOND. AND THE REASON BEING, UM THERE WAS A THERE WERE AN ASSEMBLAGE OF PROPERTIES. WHERE DO YOU LOOK AT HIGHWAY 78 BROWN. NOW THAT WAS AN ASSEMBLAGE OF MANY PROPERTIES IN THE LAST REMAINING AREA IS THAT ON SECOND STREET UM EXCEPT FOR ONE HOUSE. AND THIS REALLY WOULD JUST BE THE WESTERNMOST PART OF THE DEVELOPMENT AND WE DO HOPE TO BRIDGE THE NEW DEVELOPMENT INTO THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT SO THAT IT HAS A GOOD NICE FEEL. AND THAT IT'S UM COHESIVE. SO I DO UNDERSTAND YOUR YOUR THOUGHTS AND CONCERNS THERE. UM BUT THAT IS THERE IS ONLY ONE ON THAT STREET THAT WE DON'T OWN AT THIS TIME. AND IS THERE A REASON THAT THEY'RE WANTING TO WHY NOT LEAVE THIS ROW OF HOUSES. LIKE WEIBRING COMMERCIAL UP THAT FAR WHEN YOU HAVE READ YOU WOULD HAVE COMMERCIAL VOTING RIGHT IN FRONT OF RESIDENTIAL WHY NOT JUST LEAVE THAT WHEN I START ON THAT SIDE OF THE RESIDENTIAL AND LEAVE THAT RESIDENTIAL IS THERE A REASON BEHIND IT. JUST TO DO TO MAXIMIZE THE DEVELOP A LATE DEVELOPABLE ACREAGE OF THAT CORNER. UM, BUT. YEAH THAT WAS A DECISION MADE YEARS AGO WHEN THEY BEGAN ASSEMBLING THIS PROPERTY, AND THERE ARE NO PLANS TO JUMP ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE STREET. UM, BUT IT'S JUST AN ASSEMBLAGE OF PROPERTY AT THAT CORNER AT B, THE SOUTHWEST CORNER. OF UM HIGHWAY 78 BROWN THAT IS SUCH A SMALL STRIP COMPARED TO THE VAST AMOUNT OF LAND GOING FROM THAT, BUT THEY STARTED TO THE EAST OF THOSE HOUSES AND WENT UP TO BROWN IN 78. THAT'S A SMALL, VERY SMALL MINUTE PIECE OF PROPERTY COMPARED TO THE VAST AMOUNT THAT'S LEFT OUT THERE. I HATE TO SEE A WHOLE ROW OF HOUSES GO. AND I HAVEN'T LOOKED AT THE REST OF THOSE HOUSES. BUT I AM FAMILIAR WITH THIS ONE. AND I HATE TO SEE THIS ONE GO. I HAVE A QUESTION. SO UM, SINCE ALL AND ALL OF THEM EXCEPT FOR THE ONE, I ASSUME YOU'RE GONNA WANT TO DEMOLISH ALL. YEAH, ALL OF THEM, RIGHT? UM WHAT'S THE PLAN WITH THE ONE HOUSE LIKE, ARE Y'ALL GONNA TRY TO BUY IT IN THE FUTURE? OR DID THEY JUST SAY NO LIKE, WHAT'S THE PLAN? IS IT ONE ON THAT'S ON THE END, OR IS IT SOMEWHERE IN THE MIDDLE? IT IS ON THE END, AND THERE DO DISCUSSIONS AT THIS POINT TO PURCHASE IT. AND I CAN SAY WHETHER IT WOULD OR NOT BE PURCHASED. BUT IT'S NOT BEEN AT THIS POINT, BUT Y'ALL DID TRY AND THEY JUST SAID NO, UM I ASSUME SO. THAT WAS BEFORE MY TIME THERE. UM AND I DO BELIEVE THAT THEY CONTACTED THE PROPERTY, BUT THEY HAD NO INTEREST IN SELLING. SO I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO TABLE THIS FOR FURTHER DISCUSSION. BEFORE WE APPROVE OR DISAPPROVE I SECOND THE MOTION. DO YOU GET.
CAN I ASK? WHAT IS THE DISCUSSION? I JUST LIKE TO HAVE SOME MORE INFORMATION. LIKE I AGREE WITH. WANTING TO KNOW MORE ABOUT THIS HOUSE, THE AGES OF HOUSE UM JUST GUSHING ABOUT THE ARCHITECTURE OF THIS HOUSE. I'M NOT SURE THAT IS THIS CAN BE CONSIDERED, UH, AN ARCHITECTURE THAT WE WANT TO, UM PROTECT IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. I DON'T KNOW AND BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW, I FEEL LIKE THERE'S MORE DISCUSSION NEEDED BEFORE YOU JUST MAKE A BLANKET. YES OR NO? SO I'M SORRY, TABLING IT. JUST EXTENDS A LITTLE BIT MORE TIME FOR DISCUSSION. IT DOESN'T MEAN WE WOULD WOULDN'T APPROVE IT AT SOME POINT, BUT I'D LIKE TO HAVE MORE ANSWERS BEFORE OTHERS RIGHT AND THAT'S WHY I WAS ASKING. LIKE WHAT INFORMATION ARE YOU WANTED ME TO DO, SO I PULLED UP AN OLD SANBORN MAP AND WE HAVE ALL THESE MAPS FOR THE DOWNTOWN AND EVEN ON THE OTHER SIDE OF US
[00:30:06]
78 IN THIS ONE 1906. AND THIS IS THE CORNER OF SECOND AND JEFFERSON. THERE IS A STRUCTURE THERE. BUT IT IS NOT THIS FOOTPRINT. UM OH, YEAH. IT IS ALREADY OLD ENOUGH TO BE DEEMED HISTORIC. BUT YOU ALSO WANT TO LOOK AT. YOU WANT TO LOOK AT A NUMBER OF THINGS BEFORE YOU CAN JUST SAY IT? HISTORIC JUST BECAUSE OF AGE. I DON'T KNOW WHO'S LIVED IN THAT HOUSE. HMM.HOW ARE THEY CONNECTED TO THE CITY? THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS QUESTIONS TO ASK ABOUT. ABOUT THOSE TYPE OF THINGS. SO THIS. BOTH. SO THIS IS THE LOT RIGHT HERE. SO THERE IS A STRUCTURES.
SO WE KNOW THAT THERE'S A THERE WAS A STRUCTURE. THEY'RE NOT, YOU KNOW, SIX BUT I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S THE SAME STRUCTURE OR WHAT MODIFICATIONS MAY HAVE BEEN MADE. SO IT SOUNDS LIKE WE NEED TO FOLLOW A TRAIL. TO FIND OUT FIRST, AND THAT'S WHY I SAY IT'S YELLOW. OKAY WITH TABLING IT.
THAT'S MY MOTION. THAT WE TABLE IT. FIND OUT SOME MORE. SO WE WAIT 30 DAYS TO DECIDE. I JUST WANT TO ADD THAT LOOKING AT SANBORN MAPS A LOT. I CAN TELL. THAT IS NOT THE SAME STRUCTURE BECAUSE IT HAS A LINE OF SHOWING WHERE THE ROOF LINE IS, WHICH DOES NOT MATCH THIS. THE PORCH IS NOT MUCH TOO, BUT EVEN IF THIS ISN'T THE SAME STRUCTURE THAT WAS THERE IN THAT I AGREE OLD ENOUGH TO BE DEEMED HISTORY. SO LET'S FIND OUT MORE. WE HAVE AT LEAST WHAT CALLING CAT SHOWS.
OWNER ROCHA ROCCA, MARTIN IN 2008. AND THE BANK. TOLD ME PULLIAM TO E. D. C. NOW UM, I CAN FAMILIAR WITH PROPERTY RECORDS SO I CAN GO THROUGH ACTUAL LIKE LAND RECORDS IN COLLIN COUNTY AND SEE IF I CAN FIND SOMETHING. THERE YOU GO. BECAUSE MY I HAD TO CORRECT COLIN CAD THEY HAD MINE BUILT IN 19 FORTIES 1946. BUILT IN 18. THEY HAVE TO WRITE FLAT ON YOURS, SANBORN, HELP ME. OKAY SO MY MOTION STANDS MOTION THAT WE TABLE I SECOND THE MOTION. CAST YOUR VOTE. YES IS THE RIGHT VOTE TO TABLE LET ME CLEAR ABOUT THAT. OKAY? MAKE SURE. ALRIGHT THE MOTION TO TABLE PASSES 7 TO 0. AT THIS TIME WE'RE GOING TO WORK SESSION WORK SESSION ONE TO DISCUSS DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT ORDINANCES. THANK YOU FOR COMING AND ANSWERING OUR QUESTIONS TONIGHT. APPRECIATE IT. THANK YOU.
THIS IS ALL YOU DO IS ON ME. WELL, ALL RIGHT, THEN. UM. FIRST I'D LIKE TO THANK RENE FOR PLACING THE WORK SESSION ON THE AGENDA TONIGHT. UM BECAUSE I WANTED TO ADDRESS A FEW CONCERNS. UM THAT I HAVE AND TO ALSO HEAR FROM THE OTHER COMMISSIONERS AS WELL. I DO APOLOGIZE FOR NOT BEING PRESENT AT THE LAST HRC MEETING. I WAS OUT OF TOWN, BUT AS MOST OF YOU KNOW, I DID WATCH VIA THE LIVE STREAM. UM BUILT THAT EVEN THOUGH I WASN'T HERE TO GIVE MY IDEAS OR MY OPINIONS THAT IT WAS IMPORTANT FOR ME AS THE CHAIR OF THE COMMISSION TO HEAR YOUR COMMENTS. AND YOUR THOUGHTS ABOUT THE ITEMS ON THE AGENDA. UM THAT WE'RE RECOMMENDING TO
[00:35:05]
COUNCIL THAT NIGHT. I BELIEVE THAT THAT MEETING IN THE DISCUSSION THAT I HEARD REGARDING THE APPLICATION BEFORE THE COMMISSION THAT NIGHT. HAS GIVEN US A GREAT OPPORTUNITY TO REVISIT A NUMBER OF THINGS. UM WHETHER THE VERBIAGE OF THE INITIAL AGREED UPON, UH, ORDINANCES BY THIS COMMISSION AND THEN LATER APPROVED BY THE COUNCIL THAT IT UM WAS THAT THEY WERE APPROPRIATE, ACCURATE AND SPECIFIC ENOUGH. TO BE WHAT THEY NEEDED TO BE. ALSO THAT WE ALL HAVE A CLEAR UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT THE OFFICIAL INTERPRETATION. THE ORDINANCES ARE. BECAUSE IT CAN BE RATHER CONFUSING WHEN WE'RE ALL UM. INTERPRETING THEM DIFFERENT. AND I REALLY WANT A CLEAR INTERPRETATION OF WHAT I'M READING. WHAT WHAT I THINK THEY SAY, I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT'S WHAT THEY SAY. TODAY WHAT THE WALLY HISTORIC DISTRICT HAS APPROXIMATELY GIVE OR TAKE. 15 POSSIBLY LESS. TRUE CONTRIBUTING RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURES. AND MY THOUGHT TONIGHT IS JUST TO LOOK AT THE RESIDENTIAL. ASPECT OF THE ORDINANCES. UM, AT SOME POINT. WE CAN LOOK AT AT THE COMMERCIAL SIDE, BUT TONIGHT BECAUSE OF THIS THIS APPLICATION THAT JUST BECAME BEFORE US. I THINK WE NEED TO LOOK AT THE RESIDENTIAL CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES. ONLY THREE THAT I'M AWARE OF HAVING ANY HISTORICAL DESIGNATION TO THEM TODAY. SOME ARE CONTRIBUTING BECAUSE OF THEIR HISTORICAL ARCHITECTURE. SOME ARE DUE TO HISTORICALLY SIGNIFICANT. A SIGNAL HISTORICALLY SIGNIFICANT, SIGNIFICANT PERSON THAT WAS ASSOCIATED WITH THE CITY OF WALLY OR THE COMMUNITY, AND THERE ARE FEW ONLY A COUPLE THAT I KNOW OF, BUT A FEW THAT MEET BOTH OF THOSE CONTRIBUTING FACTORS, BOTH ARCHITECTURAL AND A SIGNIFICANT PERSON TO THE COMMUNITY. I BELIEVE THAT THE PERSON THE PURPOSE OF THE COMMISSION, AND OUR POSITION ON IT IS TO MAKE SURE THAT WE GUARANTEE THE OPPORTUNITIES IN THE FUTURE FOR ADDITIONALLY, HISTORICALLY ACCURATE STRUCTURES TO BE ADDED TO THOSE NUMBERS. IF WE JUST BUILD STRUCTURES. AND NOT HISTORICALLY ACCURATE STRUCTURES, AND WE WILL NOT BE REALLY ADDING TO OUR HISTORICAL DISTRICT. AND THAT'S IMPORTANT. I BELIEVE IF WE REALLY WANT TO BUILD OUR DISTRICT, WE NEED TO MAKE SURE WE ARE BUILDING HISTORICALLY ACCURATE STRUCTURES. UM. SO I'D LIKE FOR US TO LOOK AT THE ORDINANCES. I'VE MADE A COUPLE OF NOTES. IF ANY OF Y'ALL HAVE I WANT YOUR INPUT. OF COURSE, THAT'S WHY I'M HERE. AH! ABOUT SOME OF THE ISSUES THAT I FEEL LIKE WE HAVE. AND THEN WHAT? YOUR COMMENTS ARE SO I THINK EVERYBODY HAS A COPY OF THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT SECTION, 6.3. I THINK THE VERY FIRST THING THAT WE NEED TO LOOK AT IS THE DEFINITION OF CONTRIBUTING. CURRENTLY IT SAYS, A CONTRIBUTING BUILDING AND OR STRUCTURE IS ONE WHICH RETAINS A HIGH DEGREE OF ARCHITECTURAL INTEGRITY. THAT ADDS TO THE OVERALL HISTORIC CHARACTER OF THE DISTRICT AND WAS BUILT DURING THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE FOR THE DISTRICT. GENERALLY MORE THAN 50 YEARS AGO. THE WAY THIS IS WORDED. RIGHT NOW. THE ONLY WAY THAT A HOUSE CAN BE DEEMED HISTORIC. AS IF IT WAS BUILT. DURING THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE FOR THE DISTRICT. WHICH MEANS ANY STRUCTURE BUILT NOW OR FORWARD. CANNOT BE GAINED HISTORICALLY ACCURATE. BECAUSE IT WASN'T BUILT BACK THEN WHEN IN THE SIGNIFICANT PERIOD OF THE DISTRICT EVEN IF IT'S 50 YEARS OLD. SO I'D LIKE FOR US TO LOOK AT THIS LANGUAGE FIRST. I THINK THIS THIS IS A REAL HARD ONE FOR US. AND WHAT IS I HAD DEGREE OF ARCHITECTURAL INTEGRITY. YEAH, I WAS A PART OF THIS. WE'RE VERY MUCH IN THE BEGINNING. SO I HAVE TO TAKE SOME ACCOUNTABILITY IN THIS BUT I DIDN'T REALIZE. AND I[00:40:05]
HAD A LOT OF DISCUSSION WITH OTHER PEOPLE TO EDUCATE MYSELF A LITTLE MORE ON THIS. SO I FEEL LIKE WE NEED TO HAVE A BETTER BURBAGE OF WHAT A CONTRIBUTING BUILDING AND OR STRUCTURE IS UM.WHEN I AM ALWAYS GONNA LOOK TO YOU AS OUR HISTORIC PERSON TO GIVE ME YOUR THOUGHTS, OF COURSE. AND HOW WE CAN. HOMELESS IN BECAUSE I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT IF I BUILD A STRUCTURE TODAY. THE WAY I'M READING THIS AND INTERPRETING THIS AND OTHERS WHO HAVE READ IT AND ARE INTERPRETING IT TO ME IS THAT UNLESS THIS HOUSE WAS BUILT WAS BUILT DURING THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE FOR THE DISTRICT. AND IT WON'T BE DEEMED HISTORIC. EVEN IF IT'S 50 YEARS OLD. SO. I KNOW THAT A STRUCTURE HAS TO BE IN THE STATE OF TEXAS. HEARD THE HISTORICAL TEXAS HISTORICAL COMMISSION. IT HAS TO BE 50 YEARS OLD OR OLDER TO BE LOOKED AT AS HISTORIC. BUT THIS BURBAGE OF AN WAS BUILT DURING THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE FOR THE DISTRICT. CAN WE TAKE THAT OUT? IS THAT THE CONFUSING FACTOR? OR I WOULD SAY MAYBE. IT SHOULD READ AND WAS BUILT DURING THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE, PERIOD NOT BECAUSE I MEAN, WHEN I READ THIS, I'M THINKING IT'S TALKING ABOUT THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE BEING WAS THAT THE 19 TWENTIES WAS THAT THE 19 THIRTIES? PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE IS THE STYLE OF HOUSE. NOT AT THAT STRUCTURE THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT. IS DEMI HISTORIC WAS BUILT IN THE 19 FORTIES. THAT PARTICULAR ONE BECAUSE THEN IF WE BUILD ONE TODAY, IT'S NEVER GOING TO BE DEEMED HISTORIC BECAUSE IT WAS NOT BUILT BACK IN THE FORTIES.
HOW DO WE DEEM A WELL, I THINK THAT MAY BE DEBATABLE BECAUSE 50 YEARS FROM NOW. HOUSE THAT'S BUILT IN 2023 MAY BE SIGNIFICANT, THEN. BECAUSE THAT'S SOLID HOUSEMAID. IT'S NOT WRITTEN ABOUT NOW, BUT 50 YEARS FROM NOW, IT MAY BE. I MEAN, LOOK AT YOUR RANCH STYLE HOUSES OUT A WHOLE LOT OF PEOPLE REALLY THINK OF THOSE HOMES AS HISTORIC , BUT WE ARE GOING TO GET TO A POINT WHERE THOSE RANCH STYLES ARE HISTORIC HOMES. WE'RE JUST NOT THERE YET, AND I THINK THE SAME THING WITH THESE SAYING THAT WE COULD THEY COULD ADD A NEW ARCHITECTURE. THE CRESTOR.
VICTORIAN OKAY? YES SO, FOR INSTANCE, UM, RITA SMITH HOUSE. I DON'T KNOW WHAT YEAR THAT HOUSE WAS BUILT IN. BUT IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN IN THE LATE FIFTIES OR EARLY SIXTIES. SO IT'S LIKE RIGHT THERE ON THE ON THE CAST, YOU KNOW, AND OF ITSELF OUTSIDE OF THE ARCHITECTURE. CAN BE DEEMED HISTORIC BECAUSE OF THE PERSON WHO LIVED THERE. RIGHT? I HAVE A QUESTION, THOUGH THAT ONE ON THE CORNER. ACROSS FROM ST ANTHONY'S. THAT ONE WAS PATTERNED AFTER. IT WAS PATTERNED. OH OKAY. IT WAS PATTERNED AFTER HOUSES BUILT IN FRANCE. AND TO ME THAT IS TOTALLY OUTSIDE OF WHAT WOULD BE CONSIDERED ANY KIND OF HISTORICAL EXCEPT FOR DOWN THE ROAD 50 YEARS FROM NOW, LIKE, RENE SAID. WHEN IT WOULD BE, BUT IT DOESN'T MATCH ANY OF THE HISTORICAL HOUSES ALONG THAT BLOCK. SO YOU MIGHT NOT SAY IT'S HISTORICAL AND ARCHITECTURE IN AMERICAN ARCHITECTURE. HOWEVER. HAVE BEEN THAT HOUSE TODAY. HISTORICALLY UM, SIGNIFICANT BECAUSE OF RITA SMITH. TOTALLY JUST BECAUSE OF RITA SMITH IN THE PERSON WHO LIVED IN IT OWNED IT BUILT. AND AGAIN, IT'S NOT MAYBE AMERICAN ARCHITECTURE, ALTHOUGH MANSARD ROOFS ARE NOT NECESSARILY. YOU KNOW, NOT IN NON EXISTENT IN AMERICA. UM THERE'S NOTHING ELSE LIKE THAT IN DOWNTOWN WILEY. BUT IT'S A VERY HISTORICAL TYPE ARCHITECTURE. SO I'M JUST WANTING TO I REALLY WANT TO KNOW HOW WE CAN FIX THIS, BURBRIDGE. I'M I'M HAVING A PROBLEM WITH THAT. SO SANDRA, I WONDER, UM SO I THINK I THINK WE'RE TALKING ABOUT LIKE THREE DIFFERENT KIND OF THINGS HERE. SO THE FIRST ONE THE HIGH DEGREE OF ARCHITECTURAL INTEGRITY. I WONDER IF WE ALSO NEED TO INCLUDE SOMETHING LIKE OR HISTORICAL SIGNIFICANCE. SO, LIKE THE REAL SMITH HOUSE MIGHT
[00:45:05]
BE ONE THAT WE WOULD NEED TO INCLUDE THERE. AND SO MAYBE JUST ADDING THAT IN THEN WE'VE KIND OF OPENED IT OR BROADEN IT A BIT. SO THAT WAY, IF IT IS SOMETHING THAT'S SIGNIFICANT, THE CITY AND WE WANT TO KEEP THE STRUCTURE. EVEN IF IT DOESN'T NECESSARILY MEET SOME OF THE OTHER CRITERIA IT WOULD FIT. THEN WE CAN JUST ADD THE WORD. OR. UM WE'RE THAT ADDS TO THE OVERALL HISTORIC. CHARACTER OF THE DISTRICT AND OR WAS BUILT DURING A PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE.FOR THE DISTRICT. GENERALLY MORE THAN 50 YEARS AGO, I WOULD TAKE THOSE GENERALLY MORE THAN 50 YEARS AGO OUT. BECAUSE FOR HERE'S ANOTHER EXAMPLES, UM WE'RE NOT JUST TALKING ABOUT RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES. THERE ARE COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES TO RIGHT. BUT THIS IS UNDER THE RESIDENTIAL SPECIFIC TO RESIDENTIAL. OKAY, BOTH GENERAL, OKAY. YEAH. THIS IS BUILDING AND OUR STRUCTURE. BUILDING A STRUCTURE REALLY NEEDS. BUILDING IS A BUILDING AND OR RESIDENTIAL . I GUESS YOU USE STRUCTURE FOR THE FOR RESIDENTIAL THE WORD YOU WERE. SO WHAT IF WE SAID A CONTRIBUTING BUILDING AND OR STRUCTURE? IS ONE THAT IS BUILT WITH. THAT'S A NEW STRUCTURE IS BUILT WITH IS A NEW ONE. AND OR ONE THAT RETAINS HISTORICALLY ARCHITECTURAL. HISTORICALLY ARCHITECTURAL STANDARDS. BECAUSE THERE ARE THERE ARE HISTORICALLY ARCHITECTURAL STANDARDS. FOR EVERY ARCHITECTURE. THAT MAKES SENSE WHAT I'M SAYING. UM. AND TAKE OUT THIS, WHICH RETAINS A HARD DEGREE OF ARCHITECTURAL INTEGRITY THAT ADDS TO THE OVERALL HISTORIC DISTRICT.
CHARACTER OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. I JUST WANT TO BE ABLE TO SAY THIS AND WAS BUILT DURING THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE FOR THE DISTRICT THAT DOESN'T ALLOW ANYONE TO INTERPRET IT AS THOUGH IT HAS TO HAVE BEEN BUILT BACK THEN. AS LONG AS IT'S 50 YEARS OLD. TEXAS HISTORICAL COMMISSION SAYS YOU CAN LOOK AT IT AS BEING HISTORIC. 50 YEARS OR OLDER. SO HOW DO WE WORD. AND WAS BUILT DURING THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE FOR THE DISTRICT. THAT DOESN'T ALLOW SOMEONE TO INTERPRET BECAUSE I'VE GOT MANY PEOPLE IS INTERPRETING THAT AS WELL, YEAH, BUT IT WASN'T BUILT BACK THEN, AND THEY'RE INTERPRETING THAT AS IT HAD TO BE BUILT BACK THEN, DURING THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE, WHAT DOES THAT EVEN MEAN? THINGS ARE YOU SAYING THAT YOU WANT A HOUSE THAT'S BUILT IN 2023 TO BE A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE EVERY SINGLE TIME. INDEED, WHEN IT WANTS IT'S 50 YEARS OLD. ONCE ANY STRUCTURES 50 YEARS OLD. WHAT WHAT IT'S BEING INTERPRETED AT NOT NOT JUST BY ME. THAT THIS SIGNIFICANCE FOR DURING THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE FOR THE DISTRICT. IT'S BEING LOOKED AT AS BEING BUILT BACK WHEN THE BACK THEN. WHAT WHAT WAS THE WHAT WAS THE PERIOD DURING THE SIGNIFICANCE FOR THE DISTRICT? WHAT DOES THAT EVEN MEAN? WHAT? WHAT WAS THE YEAR THAT IT WAS TAKING A CHANCE ON THE STYLE OF HOUSE? IT WAS A CRAFTSMAN. WAS IT BUILT IN THE FORTIES OR THE TWENTIES OR WHATEVER THAT YEAR IS OR IF IT WAS QUEEN ANNE.
PERIOD OF I MEAN, THAT'S DOCUMENTED. THAT IS DOCUMENTED BY HISTORIC COMMISSION. UH, NOT THIS HISTORIC COMMISSION LIKE B, BUT IT DOESN'T HAVE COMMISSION THEN IT JUST HAS TO BE CONFORMED TO THE NO. HISTORICAL ARCHITECTURE OF THAT TIME PERIOD. NO, BECAUSE I'M ON BOARD WITH THAT ONE. NO AND THAT'S WHY I ASKED THE QUESTION. ARE YOU SAYING THAT HOUSE THAT IS BUILT TODAY? THAT IS, THE STYLE IS A QUEEN ANNE. AND IT'S YOU WANT THAT HOUSE TODAY? TO BE.
CONTRIBUTING. IT WON'T BE CONTRIBUTING FOR 50 YEARS. IT HAS TO BE OLD ENOUGH TO BE CONTROLLED. BUT I THINK THIS STYLE SHOULD BE CONTRIBUTING THESE STYLES SO THAT IN 50 YEARS , PEOPLE CAN'T BEG. OH WELL, THERE'S LIKE A SLIDING GLASS DOOR, SO IT'S NOT REALLY A QUEEN. AND SO IT'S NEVER GONNA IN 50 YEARS. IT'S NEVER GOING TO BE HISTORICAL. SO I THINK THE
[00:50:02]
POINT YES IS EVERY NEW RESIDENTIAL BUILDINGS SHOULD IT'S FOR DESIGN. BE APPROPRIATE FOR THAT. SO THAT IN 50 YEARS IT COULD BE SO THEN LET ME ASK THIS QUESTION. ARE YOU WANTING TO CREATE THIS TO SUIT WILDLY? OR ARE YOU WANTING. TO CREATE THIS TO BE IN LINE WITH THE UNITED STATES. SECRETARY OF INTERIOR INTERNATIONAL STANDARDS SAYS IF A HOUSE IS BUILT TODAY, AND IT'S TO RESEMBLE A CRAFTSMAN, THERE SHOULD BE SOMETHING IN THAT THAT SAYS THIS HOUSE WAS BUILT TODAY.IT WAS NOT BUILT. THE STANDARDS DO NOT WANT YOU TO BUILD A STRUCTURE TODAY. AND SOMEONE HAS TO SIT THERE AND REALLY, REALLY WONDER. WAS THAT BUILT IN 1920? IT WAS THAT BUILT INTO THERE SHOULD BE NOT NECESSARILY SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCE, BUT THERE SHOULD BE A DIFFERENCE WHERE YOU AND I I'LL PULL IT UP IN A MINUTE BECAUSE I HAVE THE EXACT WORDING THAT THEY SAY. AND IT'S BASICALLY THAT YOU WANTED TO RESEMBLE YOU WANT IT TO CONFORM OR YOU WANT IT TO BE COMPATIBLE, BUT THERE SHOULD BE A DIFFERENCE WHERE YOU KNOW THAT THIS HOUSE WAS NOT BUILT. IN 1920, A REPRODUCTION IS NOT AN ORIGINAL, RIGHT? PERFECT. BUT ORIGINAL ENOUGH THAT IT MEETS THE ARCHITECTURAL STANDARDS. NOT EVERY SINGLE DETAIL IT CAN'T. IT CAN'T BE AS ORIGINAL AS AN ORIGINAL BECAUSE THE ARCHITECTURAL AND THE MANUFACTURING, CEREALS, PROCESSES AND MATERIALS AND TOOLS AND EVERYTHING WERE DIFFERENT. I GET, AND I AGREE THAT THE THAT THE MATERIALS COULD BE SOMEWHAT DIFFERENT, OF COURSE. OF COURSE, YOU'RE NOT GONNA GET THE SAME MATERIALS. AS WHAT YOU'VE GOT BACK THEN. BUT THE ARCHITECTURE ITSELF WILL STILL HAVE I'M GONNA USE A CRAFTSMAN ALL THE TIME. CRAFTSMAN WINDOWS, UH, THE ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENTS AROUND THE WINDOWS. UM THE TOP OF DOOR THAT IS ON THAT HOUSE, THE PORCH HOW THAT PORCHES ARRANGED THE RAILINGS. ALL THOSE THINGS WILL BE THE SAME. SOME MATERIALS.
WILL BE DIFFERENT BECAUSE YOU'RE GOING TO UPGRADE THEIR ALWAYS UPGRADING MATERIALS. BUT ALL THE OTHER ASPECTS ARCHITECTURALLY ARE THE SAME AS WHAT THEY WERE WHEN THEY THERE IS NO SLIDING GLASS DOOR. ON A ON A CRAFTSMAN HOUSE. UNLESS YOU ARE ALLOWING SOMEBODY TO BUILD THEIR OWN STYLE OF CRAFTSMAN IN SOME SUBDIVISION SOMEWHERE. AND I'M ALL FOR THAT. I'M NOT ALL FORWARD IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. WELL YOU KNOW, I WAS LOOKING LIKE THE MEETING WE HAD LAST TIME. ON BUILDING THAT CRAFTSMAN HOME. AND YOU KNOW, WE REQUIRED THEM TO ADD. YOU WEREN'T HERE. I'M SORRY, BUT WE DID REQUIRE THEM TO ADD, UH A RAILING. AND BUT WHEN I WHEN YOU LOOK AT THOSE PICTURES, THOSE WINDOWS ARE NOT ORIGINAL. TYPE WINDOWS. THEY'RE NOT IN THE FORMAT. OF THE WAY ACROSS MEN WOULD BE BECAUSE CRAFTSMAN'S WERE BUILT. BACK THEN TO ENCOURAGE AIRFLOW BECAUSE THERE WAS NO AIR CONDITIONING. AND SO THE WINDOWS WERE VERY SPECIFICALLY AND STRATEGICALLY PLACED. UM, AND THAT HOUSE DOESN'T HAVE THOSE FEATURES. SO THEN. YOU KNOW? WILL THERE BE VARIANCES TO WHAT'S ALLOWED TO BE BUILT IN THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT. OR DO DOES DOES THE BOARD GET VERY STRICT ABOUT ITS REQUIREMENTS? IN TERMS OF NEW CONSTRUCTION. AND THEN IF ALL NEW CONSTRUCTION IS WITHIN THOSE MEETS AND BOUNDS, SO TO SPEAK. THEN JUST ALL NEW CONSTRUCTION BECOME HISTORIC. SO THIS IS WHAT THE ACCORDING TO THE U. S SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARD SAYS NEW CONSTRUCTION SHOULD ALSO BE DISTINCT FROM THE OLD AND MUST NOT ATTEMPT TO REPLICATE HISTORIC BUILDINGS ELSEWHERE ON SITE AND TO AVOID CREATING A FALSE SENSE OF HISTORIC DEVELOPMENT. I THINK THAT'S THE WORD. WHAT I WAS LOOKING FOR THAT FALSE SENSE. AND THEN THERE'S ANOTHER ONE NEW ADDITIONS, EXTERIOR ALTERATIONS OR RELATED NEW CONSTRUCTION SHOW. DESTROY. SHALL NOT SORRY, SHALL NOT DESTROY HISTORIC MATERIALS THAT CHARACTERIZED THE PROPERTY. THE NEW WORK SHALL BE DIFFERENTIATED FROM THE OLD AND SHALL BE COMPATIBLE WITH THE MASSIVE SIZE SCALE ARCHITECTURE FEATURES TO PROTECT. HISTORIC
[00:55:01]
INTEGRITY OF THE PROPERTY AND ITS ENVIRONMENT. AND YOU KNOW OF COURSE, WITH THE. SECRETARY OF INTERIORS. THERE'S A LOT THAT, YOU KNOW. ARE YOU RENOVATING? TRULY A HISTORIC BUILDING, OR YOU ADDING SOMETHING NEW TO IT, AND THEY WANT TO BE ABLE TO TELL WHAT'S THE NEW PART? SO I THINK, AT LEAST ACCORDING TO THE SECRETARY OF INTERIORS. THE OLD SHOULD TRULY TRULY BE PRESERVED, NO MATTER WHAT. NOW IF YOU ADD TO THAT, WHATEVER THAT NEW ADDITION IS, SHOULD CLEARLY BE.YOU SHOULD CLEARLY BE ABLE TO TELL WHAT'S THE OLD AND WHAT'S NEW. SO YOU KNOW, IT REALLY COMES BACK TO THIS BOARD OF ARE YOU TRYING TO REPLICATE? TO THE VERY, VERY LETTER. OR ARE YOU TRYING TO TRULY PRESERVE YOUR HISTORIC BUILDINGS AND STRUCTURES? AND THEN BE COMPATIBLE WITH YOUR NEW CONSTRUCTION. UM I JUST WANT TO SAY SOMETHING BECAUSE I SO THIS HOUSE THAT CAME UP IT DIDN'T MEET A LOT OF REQUIREMENTS. SO I THINK LIKE I MEAN, FOR EXAMPLE, THE GARAGE WAS ATTACHED. UM THAT DIDN'T HAVE RAILINGS. THEY FIXED THAT THE PORCH IS SUPPOSED TO BE AT LEAST TWO THIRDS OF THE WIDTH OF THE HOUSE. I MEAN, THERE WERE THERE THAT THEY'RE THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE A 6 FT SIDEWALK, WHICH I KNOW IS THE CITY'S THING, BUT IT'S IN THE ORDINANCES. I MEAN, THERE WAS JUST MULTIPLE THINGS, SO I THINK THERE CAN BE ALLOWANCES FOR LITTLE THINGS SPECIFICALLY TO SHOW THAT IT ISN'T THAT WE'RE NOT TRYING TO ACT LIKE THIS HOUSE IS, YOU KNOW, 150 YEARS OLD OR WHATEVER. BUT I THINK THE VARIANCES THAT ARE ALLOWED TO BE MINIMAL AND NOT LIKE YOU KNOW. SIX ITEMS FOR ONE HOUSE, AND THAT TO ME IS WHAT IS PROBLEMATIC. IT'S LIKE, YEAH, I GET SO LIKE, FOR EXAMPLE, THAT CRAFTSMAN IF THEY HAD FIXED EVERYTHING, BUT LIKE MAYBE KEPT THE WINDOWS BEEN LIKE IN LIKE THAT WEREN'T TRUE CRAFTSMEN, THEN MAYBE, BUT IT'S LIKE I THINK EVERYTHING ELSE WAS ALSO HMM. NOT ACCORDING TO THE ORDINANCES. AND FOR ME, THAT WAS PART OF THAT PROBLEM. I'M JUST TRYING TO MAKE SURE THAT WHEN SOMEBODY WE SAY THAT THEY HAVE TO BUILD A. HISTORICALLY ACCURATE STRUCTURE. IS COHESIVE WITH THE DISTRICT THAN FIND ME A CRAFTSMAN WITH AN ATTACHED GARAGE. FIND ME A VICTORIAN WITH AN ATTACHED GARAGE. AGAIN NOT SAYING WE CAN'T GIVE SOMETHING THAT I THINK IT SHOULD BE GIVEN ARE ARE EXCEPTIONS SHOULD BE MINIMAL AND NOT SO WIDESPREAD THAT SOMEBODY SAYS YEAH, THAT'S A CRAFTSMAN. I DON'T RECOGNIZE IT AS A CRAFTSMAN AT ALL. I MEAN, THE ONLY THING I SAW IN THAT HOUSE WAS THOSE BARS THAT THE EASY THINGS THAT STICK OUT. AND. OKAY THOSE TWO POSTS COULD RESEMBLE A CRESCENT POST. AND I WOULD LIKE A SQUARE BOX. THAT YOU SEE IN ANY SUBDIVISION WITH A COUPLE OF ELEMENTS ON IT. TO ME. THAT'S NOT A HISTORIC HOUSE. TODAY AND NOT IN 50 YEARS. SO WE HAVE TO DECIDE WHAT WE WANT IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. I MEAN, DO WE WANT A HOUSE THAT WE CAN ADD TO THE NUMBERS OF HIS HISTORICALLY ACCURATE HOMES OR DO WE JUST 50 YEARS. DO WE WANT TO SAY WELL, NOW WE'VE GOT 150 STRUCTURES IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. OH, BUT 10 OF THEM ARE STILL HISTORIC. WE DIDN'T ADD IN 50 YEARS WE DIDN'T HAD ONCE STRUCTURE THAT WE CAN BLACK FOR HISTORICAL DESIGNATION ON. BUT I THINK THAT'S REALLY HARD TO SEE. BECAUSE IN 50 YEARS YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT A HISTORIC STRUCTURE I MEAN, HALF THE HOUSES WE LIVE IN NOW. 50 YEARS, 75 YEARS FROM NOW. I MEAN, THEY MAY BE IN SPACE. SHIP HOUSES BY THE END, AND OUR HOUSES WILL BE HISTORIC.
YEAH I DON'T LIVE IN THAT. NEVER NEVER LAND ROOM. I MEAN, I DON'T SEE ANY HOUSE IN ANY SUBDIVISION IN THIS TOWN BEING DEEMED HISTORIC. 100 YEARS FROM NOW, WE'LL BE WE'RE ALL GONNA BE LONG GONE IN HERE. YES, WE HAVE TO THINK ABOUT NOW. NOW THEY'RE NOT HISTORIC. I MEAN, AND IT DIDN'T JUST BUILD IN. OKAY SO WITH THAT THOUGHT, THEN YOU CAN REALLY JUST BUILD ANYTHING BECAUSE IN 100 YEARS AND BE NO, YOU'RE PLAYING IN A WAY, BUT BUT NO RIGHT NOW, ACCORDING TO THE ALREADY ORDINANCE IF YOU DON'T CHANGE A THING IN IT, NO, YOU CANNOT BUILD JUST ANYTHING. AND
[01:00:06]
I THINK ALISON HAD THE PERFECT SUMMATION IS YES, YOU DON'T HAVE TO BUILD A CRAFTSMAN OR VICTORIAN EXACTLY TO EVERY SINGLE LETTER THAT, THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR SAYS. BUT YOU'RE VARIANCES SHOULD BE MINIMIZED AND I THINK THAT'S WHERE THE BOARD COMES IN IS WHERE IS THE LINE? AND I DON'T THINK THE LINE SHOULD BE YOU DO EVERYTHING. BUT NOR DO I THINK THAT THAT APPLICANTS SHOULD COME IN BECAUSE, AFTER ALL, THEY BOUGHT A PIECE OF PROPERTY IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. AND THE GUIDELINES ARE THERE THEY SHOULDN'T COME IN AND ASK FOR EVERYTHING. BUT I DO FEEL LIKE THERE NEEDS TO BE ALIGNED. AND HONESTLY, I BELIEVE THAT LINE FERRIES IT'S A PROJECT BY PROJECT JUST BECAUSE THIS LOT GOT FIVE VARIANCES. THIS NEXT LOT MAY ONLY GET TO BUT THAT'S WHERE THIS BOARD COMES IN WITH THAT CONVERSATION. I JUST WANT TO ADD ONE THING BECAUSE AT THE CITY COUNCIL MEETINGS, SHE DID GET UP AND SPOKE AND SAID THAT, UM SHE EVEN SAID. THERE'S JUST SO MANY ORDINANCE ORDINANCES. BUT SHE HAD TO FOLLOW WITHOUT BEING IT WAS KIND OF INFERRING THAT SHE DIDN'T THEY KIND OF JUST DIDN'T BECAUSE THERE WERE SO MANY. SO I THINK FOR ME THAT'S ALSO LIKE I SEE THAT POINT. BUT ALSO YOU'RE RIGHT.SHE BOUGHT THAT PIECE OF LAND. UNFORTUNATELY THOSE ARE THE RESTRICTIONS AND AGAIN WE CAN ALLOW VARIANCES, BUT NOT FOR ALL OF THEM JUST BECAUSE YOU THINK THERE'S TOO MANY BECAUSE YOU DON'T WANT TO BURY IT YOURSELF OUT OF HAVING A STRUCTURE THAT YOU DON'T EVEN RECOGNIZE AS ANY ARCHITECTURE AT ALL. AND I DON'T THINK THAT ONE MINUTE. I MEAN, YOU CAN GOOGLE AND I DID THAT. I GOOGLED AND I SENT INFORMATION TO COUNSEL. I MEAN, CRAFTSMAN IS NOT JUST A CRAFTSMAN. YOU HAVE ALL KINDS OF CRAFTSMAN NOW. AGAIN. I THINK IT'S UP TO THIS BOARD OR SOMEONE COMES AND SAY, WELL, HEY, I'M BUILDING A BUNGALOW CRAFTSMAN, BUT I WANT THIS ARTS AND CRAFTS TEXTURE TO IT ALSO, AND ALL THESE MIXTURES. THEN THAT'S WHEN THE CONVERSATION I THINK HAS TO HAPPEN WITH THIS BOARD, AND IT DOESN'T BECOME PERSONAL. BUT IT'S MORE OF OKAY, YOU'RE ASKING FOR 10, DIFFERENT VARIANCES. AND NOW WHAT YOU DESIGN HAS NO RESEMBLANCE OF A CRAFTSMAN STYLE HOUSE. SO LET'S TALK ABOUT THIS. AND YOU KNOW THAT'S A CONVERSATION THAT AT SOME POINT EVEN BEFORE IT GETS TO YOU STAFF IS GOING TO HAVE WITH THE APPLICANT BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY THAT AFRICAN GETS TO BRING WHAT THEY WANT. AND THEN YOU ALL HAVE A CONVERSATION TO ASK. IS IT POSSIBLE THAT WHEN WE GET THE REPORT LIKE A NEW CREATIVE FOR YOU, TOO, AND IF THE ANSWER IS NO, THAT'S OKAY TO SAY HOW MANY VARIANCES BASICALLY THEY'RE ASKING FOR. YOU CAN READ THAT AND SAY, OH, THAT DOESN'T MEET THAT REQUIREMENT. IF NOT, I MEAN, I CAN DO IT, BUT OKAY, THAT WOULD BE GOOD TO KNOW AHEAD OF TIME LIKE THEY'RE ONLY ASKING FOR ONE, AND THAT'S REALLY WHAT WE NEED TO FOCUS ON OUR A LOT OF .
I WILL ALWAYS I'LL ASK YOU A QUESTION. UM SO THE ORGANS OF THE ORDINANCE THAT STATES THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE 6 FT SIDEWALKS ON NEW CONSTRUCTION. I KNOW THE CITY IS RESPONSIBLE FOR MAKING THE SIDEWALKS CORRECT. NOT NECESSARILY. UM MOST TIME WHEN DEVELOPMENT COMES IN, BUT RIGHT NOW, WHAT'S GOING ON WITH ALL THESE STUDIES THAT WE'RE DOING IN DOWNTOWN? WE DON'T HONESTLY KNOW IF JACKSON IS GOING TO BE A ONE WAY OR TWO WAY GOING NORTH GOING SOUTH. SO TO IMPOSE THAT ON A DEVELOPMENT NOW REALLY DOESN'T MAKE A WHOLE LOT OF SENSE GOT YOU COULD PUT IT IN AND GETS TORN OUT OR WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, BUT LIKE, LET'S SAY IN THE FUTURE, A DIFFERENT PLACE.
UM IS THAT SOMETHING WE COULD ENFORCE AND SAY THAT YOU WANT TO BUILD THIS HOME? YOU NEED TO HAVE SIX MONTHS. IF THAT'S THE KIND OF THE VICTIM. WE'RE GOING, OKAY? OKAY, LET'S GO OVER TO PAGE 148. THE. ADAM TO SEE THE WHOLE ENCOURAGE DISCOURAGE. HOW DO WE TIGHTEN THAT UP? YOU
[01:05:19]
TELL ME WHAT YOU WANT TO SAY. WHAT DO YOU WANT TO TIGHTEN UP? I DON'T LIKE THE WE ENCOURAGED.I MEAN, IT'S ALMOST WORTHLESS BURBAGE ON A PAGE WE ENCOURAGE THIS. WE DISCOURAGE THIS. BUT THEN THEY CAN JUST SUBMIT WHATEVER THEY WANT. RIGHT? THIS PROBABLY CAME ABOUT AND FRANJO, YOU'RE PROBABLY. THE ONLY ONE ON THE BOARD WHEN THIS IS LIKE PROBABLY SHORTLY AFTER THIS BOARD WAS EVEN CREATED. JUST REMEMBER THERE WAS A MEETING. I FORGOT WHO THE APPLICANT WAS WHAT THEY WANTED TO DO, AND IT GOT DOWN TO THIS BOARD. PICKING THE COLOR THE SHADE OF ORANGE OR WHATEVER ORANGE ON A DOOR AND WE SPENT PROBABLY 40 MINUTES TALKING ABOUT A SHADE OF BLACK.
AND. WHEN IT GOT TO COUNSEL COUNTS, AND AT THAT POINT, I THINK FINAL APPROVAL WAS THROUGH THE BOARD. IT DIDN'T EVEN GO TO COUNCIL AND THEN STATE REGULATIONS CHANGE THAT HAD TO DO THAT. AND COUNCIL FELT LIKE THIS BOARD WAS JUST TWO IN THE WEEK. SO A LOT OF THINGS GOT TO BE OR A ENCOURAGED AND DISCOURAGE. NOT I YOU WILL DO THIS OR YOU WON'T DO THAT. IF THIS IS SOMETHING YOU WANT US TO LOOK AT OR REMOVED. I MEAN, COULD WE SAY SOMETHING MORE LIKE ALMOST ALWAYS OR SHALL I LIKE BUT NOT ENCOURAGED, BUT ALMOST ALWAYS BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY AGAIN, THERE WILL BE VARIANCES ALLOWED. MAYBE THEY DON'T WANT TO HAVE A CHIMNEY OR SOMETHING. BUT AS MANY OF THEM AS POSSIBLE. COULD WE SAY THAT? STRUCTURES ADAM SEE ALL STRUCTURES SHALL RETAIN ORIGINAL ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENTS. YOU DON'T WANT SHELL. WELL. GENERALLY WHEN YOU'RE WRITING AN ORDINANCE WHEN YOU SAY, SHALL THAT THAT'S A YOU HAVE TO DO THIS, NO MATTER WHAT. THAT'S A KEY WORD UNLESS SOMEBODY ELSE INTERPRETS IT DIFFERENT. I WILL TELL YOU THIS. THAT THE CITY ATTORNEY AND THE JUDGE IS GOING TO INTERPRET THAT ONE WAY ONLY. OF THE CITY RIGHTS. YOU SHALL DO THIS. YOU WILL DO IT. IS SHALL CONSTITUTIONAL SHELL. SHELL SEEMS NICER THAN MUST. YEAH.
KIND OF RAID SAYS WE'RE GONNA BE NICE. AND SO YOU SHALL SO, ACCORDING TO THE STATE OF TEXAS, THOUGH WE ARE ADVISORY. WE ARE NOT. ABLE TO REALLY ADVISORY BOARD TO THE COUNCIL NOT TO AN APPLICANT. WE CAN TELL THE APPLICANT WHAT WE WANT. BUT. OKAY ADVISORY TO THE COUNCIL.
OKAY? IS THAT WHAT YOUR E BUT I'M THINKING IF WE PUT IT IN HERE AND SAY CHOW, OR, UM OR LIKE A MESSAGE HERE TO THIS. THING I MEAN, THEY'RE GONNA GO BACK COUNCIL IS GOING TO GO BACK AND READ THIS. AND SEE THAT IT'S A MUSTER. IT'S A SHALL OR OR WHATEVER, RIGHT, SO I ARE YOU SAYING? NO, WE'RE SHELL. I THINK IT'S TOO STRONG BECAUSE WE'RE ADVISORS, RIGHT? WE'RE NOT ACTUALLY SETTING LAW AND DOING THAT. I DON'T KNOW. IT JUST IT FEELS TOO STRONG TO ME. TAKE COUNSEL BUT YET SPIT ON ORDINANCE IS NOT GET TOO DIFFERENTLY. I WOULDN'T SAY SHOWERS IS JUST STRONG LANGUAGE THAT I MEAN, THAT'S LIKE YOU'RE TELLING THEM WHAT THEY HAVE TO DO, AND THAT'S THAT'S DEFINITELY OVERSTEPPING. TELL ME IN THE ORDINANCE THAT I SHALL HAVE AN 8 FT PRINTS AROUND MY YARD. I CAN'T I CANNOT HAVE A 10 FT PRINTS I HAVE. I SHALL HAVE A WELL I THINK WHAT YOU FIRST NEED TO DECIDE WHETHER YOU USE THE WORST SHELL OR ENCOURAGE IS WHAT IS IT THAT YOU WANT TO NEED TO DO? IF YOU'RE SAYING THEY SHALL HAVE A CHIMNEY? VIEW. WELL, THAT'S HARD TO SAY, BECAUSE THIS . THIS IS WHAT I'M SAYING. I'M SAYING THAT YOU SHALL KEEP THE ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENTS THAT GO WITH WHATEVER ARCHITECTURAL STYLE YOU ARE WANTING TO BUILD.
AND IF I WANT TO GIVE YOU A PASS ON A CHIMNEY BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT GOING TO REALLY HAVE A FIREPLACE
[01:10:03]
INSIDE YOUR HOUSE LIKE THIS PAST HOUSE THAT WAS PASSED. SOMEBODY SAID SOMETHING ABOUT A CHIMNEY.BUT BUT YET THERE WASN'T GONNA BE A FIREPLACE ARCHITECTURALLY. YES A CRAFTSMAN HAS A CHIMNEY AND FIREPLACE. BUT IF THAT HOUSE DIDN'T WANT IT, BUT THEN IF THEY KEPT 123456 IF THEY KEPT FIVE OUT OF THE SIX ELEMENTS BE HAPPY. SO THEN YOU CAN'T SAY SHALL IF YOU IF YOU SAY SHALL THEN THEY HAVE TO DO IT. AND SO YOU DON'T GET TO GO BACK AND SAY , WELL, I'M GOING TO GIVE YOU A PASS ON THAT IF THE ORDINANCES SHALL THAT'S A REQUIREMENT NOW, AND WE CAN'T OVERSTEP THAT. MANY PEOPLE IF YOU WANT IF YOU WANT. TO ALLOW THE VARIANCES AT YOUR DISCRETION, THEN TO ME. ALL THIS PARAGRAPHS OF BASICALLY SAY, IS YOU KIND OF SELECT YOUR STYLE. YOUR PERIOD STYLE HOUSE AND MEAT. CERTAIN. OH YOU COULD SAY YOU HAVE TO MEET YOU HAVE TO MEET FIVE OUT OF SIX OF THE ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENTS OF THE HOUSE. I MEAN, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. I THINK THAT'S A BETTER LANGUAGE THAN I ENCOURAGE. AND I DISCOURAGED BECAUSE. THAT'S JUST DO DO WE AS A BOARD OR AS A CITY HAVE A WRITTEN DESCRIPTION OF THE ARCHITECTURAL FEATURES OF THE STYLES OF THE HOMES WITHIN DIDN'T STORE DISTRICT. WELL NOT NECESSARILY IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. I MEAN, I THINK IT'S IN OUR ORDINANCE, BUT BY WHOEVER I CAN'T REMEMBER HER NAME SOMETHING SUB ELSTER REVEL. IT'S A HISTORIC HOUSE BOOK. I MEAN, IT'S TONS IN TERMS OF PAGES OF EVERY SINGLE RECOGNIZED HISTORICAL HOUSE. THAT'S RECOGNIZED BY THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR. AND EACH ONE OF THOSE SECTIONS TELLS YOU UM, THE DIFFERENT, RECOGNIZABLE CHARACTER FEATURES OF A CRISTMAN OR VICTORIAN OR MODERN OR OF ALL THOSE THINGS, AND WHEN AN APPLICANT COMES TO STAFF, I PULLED THAT BOOK OUT AND I'M FLIPPING THROUGH IT. OKAY THIS HAS THIS CHARACTERISTICS THIS CHARACTERISTIC, SO IT'S THIS DOLLHOUSE. THEN THE APPLICANT COMES TO YOU WITH WHATEVER THOSE VARIANTS AS WELL, IT DOESN'T HAVE THE CHIMNEY. BUT IT HAS THESE AND AGAIN, THAT'S WHAT CONVERSATIONS TALK. AND ALL OF IT IS NOT BASED ON WHAT HOUSES ARE HERE AND WILDLY. IT IS REALLY BASED ON THAT BOOK. AND THE SECRETARY OF MATERIAL. THERE'S REALLY A HATE PROBABLY A HANDFUL OF DIFFERENT ARCHITECTURAL STYLES AND DOWNTOWN WILEY AS COMPARED TO NATIONWIDE. UM, BUT. FOR INSTANCE, WE HAD A LOT OF DISCUSSION IN THE LAST MEETING ON WHAT THE FEATURES OF A CRAFTSMAN WERE. AND THE GARAGE CAME INTO PLAY. THE FRONT PORCH CAME INTO PLAY, BUT LIKE REALLY THINKING ABOUT THERE'S A LOT MORE THAT WAS OVERLOOKED AND THAT DISCUSSION REGARDING THE ARCHITECTURAL FEATURES OF A CRAFTSMAN. SOME. MAYBE. WE IN PREPARATION FOR THOSE. REQUESTS WE BECOME FAMILIAR WITH. THAT PARTICULAR ARCHITECTURE. I MEAN, WE HAVE PRAIRIE. WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A PRAYER AND A CRAFTSMAN? VERY SIMILAR, BUT THEY'RE DIFFERENT. YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT'S A GREAT IDEA. I THINK WE DO NEED TO BE FROM COMPLETELY FAMILIAR WITH THEM, UM, SO THAT WE CAN MAKE THE DECISIONS THAT WE NEED TO MAKE.
UM BUT IF WE HAVE IN HERE, THESE SIX ELEMENTS THAT WERE ENCOURAGING RATHER NOT ENCOURAGING. I WOULD SAY, I WOULD LIKE TO SAY THAT YOU HAVE TO MEET OR IF YOU KNOW. BASED ON THAT BOOK THAT THERE ARE 15 ELEMENTS OF A, UM VICTORIAN ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENTS OR YOU KNOW, EVERY VICTORIAN YOU HAVE TO MEET MUST MEET. 14 OUT OF 16. OR YOU MUST MEET, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE THEN WE'RE GIVING THEM WHAT THOSE ELEMENTS ARE. MM. BUT WE'RE NOT MAKING THEM DO EVERY ELEMENT. BUT WE'RE LIMITING THE NUMBER OF CONSIDERATIONS WE'RE GOING TO GIVE SO THAT WE CAN LOOK AT THAT HOUSE AND TRULY KNOW WHAT STYLE IT IS BECAUSE THEY MET A GREAT THE GREATER MAJORITY OF THE ELEMENTS. AND NOT JUST ONE OR TWO. SO NOW LOOKS LIKE. THE PROBLEM I HAVE WITH THAT IS BECAUSE THEN YOU YOU PUT YOURSELF IN A BOX OF YOU PICKED SEVEN OF THESE 15. WELL,
[01:15:11]
YOU MAY NOT LIKE THE SEVEN THAT THEY PICKED BUT IT'S ABOUT. IT'S NOT ABOUT WHAT YOU LIKE PERSONALLY. BUT TO ME, IT CLOSES THAT CONVERSATION. FOR ME BECAUSE I DIDN'T. THEN YOU DON'T HAVE A CONVERSATION OF LET ME SEE. HOW DO I SAY IT? JASON HELPED ME OUT. SO I KIND OF LIKE HOW I LOOK AT PLANNED DEVELOPMENTS. PLANNED DEVELOPMENTS COME TO THE CITY AND COUNCIL, OR P, AND Z IS TALKING TO THAT DEVELOPER. IF IN THE ORDINANCE, IT ALREADY SAYS, YOU HAVE TO PICK FIVE OF THESE SEVEN THEY PICKED THE FIVE YOU HAVE NO RECOURSE. YOU HAVE NO WAY OUT. BUT IF I DON'T TELL YOU TO PICK FIVE, I JUST SAY, HEY, YOU PICK FROM THE CHARACTERISTICS OF THIS STYLE HOUSE. THEN IT OPENS UP THIS BOARD FOR A CONVERSATION ONLY PICKED TOO. WELL WHAT DO YOU HAVE A WAY OUT, BUT IT'S GOING TO SAY IS, I THINK WHAT WHAT I'M HEARING IS THAT LET'S SAY THEY HAVE TO PICK SEVEN OUT OF THE 15. AND THEY PICKED SEVEN AND BY PICKING THOSE SPECIFIC SEVEN ITEMS. IT DOESN'T REALLY LOOK LIKE, FOR EXAMPLE, CRAFTSMAN, AND SO THEN THE SEVENTH, SO IT DOESN'T LOOK CRAFTSMAN, SO THAT'S TOO BAD, SO THE ELEMENTS OF THAT STYLE WELL, RIGHT, BUT BUT IF THEY'RE NOT MEETING ENOUGH TO MAKE IT LOOK LIKE A CRAFTSMAN, THEN IT'S I THINK THAT'S THE PROBLEM. I'M LOOKING AT IT LIKE I CAN. I CAN PICK SEVEN OF 15, BUT THE SEVEN THAT I PICKED MIXING THOSE SEVEN JUST DOESN'T DO WHAT THAT HOUSE NEEDS TO DO IF THEY'RE GOING TO GET SOME UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES. IF YOU DO THAT, BECAUSE IT'S A GREAT EXAMPLE IS UM, FOR THE LONGEST TIME WHEN WE COULD REGULATE THE BUILDING MATERIALS.IT SAID ON A UM, COMMERCIAL BUILDING YOU HAVE YOU HAD TO HAVE 20% STONE. AND THE IDEA BEHIND IT WAS THAT YOU WOULD END UP WITH SOME ARCHITECTURAL VARIATION. THE REALITY OF IT WAS IS EVERYBODY WENT 4 FT UP HIGH ON STONE AND WRAPPED IT AROUND THEIR BUILDING, AND THAT WAS THE END OF IT. AND SO YOU JUST NEED TO BE VERY, VERY CAREFUL. I AGREE WITH RENEE AND MS STOWE ON THIS THAT YOU'RE BETTER OFF, LEAVING YOURSELF. A LOT OF WIGGLE ROOM. I MEAN, THIS IS A THIS BOARD HAS A LOT OF GRAY AREA IN IT, AND THAT'S A GREAT THING THAT THIS WIGGLE ROOM GAVE ME A SQUARE BOX. WITH MAYBE THREE ELEMENTS OF A CRAFTSMAN. AND THAT WAS APPROVED. THAT'S WHAT I HAVE A PROBLEM IS ULTIMATELY DENIED. IT'S NOT EXACTLY GOTTA PROVE. CANCEL DIDN'T APPROVE IT BECAUSE YOU'VE GOT IT. I WASN'T THE ONLY. ONE UM, HAS A MIND OF THEIR OWN.
LET'S JUST SAY THAT CANCELED COUNCIL DOES HAVE A MIND OF THEIR OWN. I POINTED IT OUT.
COUNCIL DOES HAVE. I DON'T HAVE CONTROL OVER OUR COUNCIL. DO WE HAVE TO HAVE THE LIKE THE WHOLE SECTION IN THERE. I MEAN, BECAUSE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT YEAH. I MEAN, BECAUSE THEN WE CAN STILL SAY THEY'RE USING VINYL WINDOWS. WE DON'T LIKE THEM. WE WANT YOU TO USE WOOD.
SO WHY EVEN HAVE IT IN THERE? MY BOSS. SO IS THAT THE DIRECTION ON THIS PART JUST TO HAVE US LOOK AT JUST TAKING THAT? FULL, ENCOURAGE AND DISCOURAGE OUT AND LEAN MORE TOWARDS, UM JUST HAVING. I DON'T KNOW IF YOU SAY SIGNIFICANT CHARACTERISTICS OF THE PERIOD STYLE HOUSE. AND YOU KNOW, AND TO ME. IF SOMEBODY COMES WELL DEFINED SIGNIFICANT WILL DEFINE IT WHEN YOU BRING YOUR PROJECT. HEY RENEE. UM, JUST A THOUGHT. BUT. DO YOU WANT ? I'M NOT SURE YOU WANT TO DO THIS IN THE ORDINANCE PER SE, BUT REFERENCING A BOOK OR A SERIES OF BOOKS. THAT HAVE THOSE ITEMS. I MEAN, I KNOW YOU ALREADY CHECK IT AGAINST YOUR PARTICULAR FIELD GUIDE BECAUSE I SEE IT ON YOUR DESK EVERY TIME I TALK TO YOU, YOU KNOW, IT'S YEAH, IT'S RIGHT THERE ON THE I MEAN, IT'S ON THE TOP. NO MATTER WHAT ELSE SHE'S GOT GOING ON THAT BOOK, IT'S ALWAYS ON THE TOP OF ALL HER PAPERWORK. SO I KNOW SHE LOOKS AT IT EVERY DAY. UM, BUT THAT'S JUST A THOUGHT.
UM THAT YOU COULD I HAVE SOMETHING THAT. GETS RID OF THESE ITEMS, BUT THEN RELATES TO A PARTICULAR YOU KNOW, SOME KIND OF EXPERT YOU KNOW, A RECOGNIZED EXPERT I LIKE THAT MUCH BETTER SO THEY CAN SEE IDEAS, AND IT GIVES US MUCH MORE LEEWAY TO GO BACK. AND WE DON'T LIKE THIS FIX
[01:20:01]
THIS OR WHATEVER. I THINK I WOULD ALSO AGREE WITH THAT, UM KIND OF REMOVING IT HERE AND GIVING THEM SOMETHING TO REFERENCE. UM AS LONG AS WE DON'T I THINK HAVE WHAT SPECIFICALLY, THEY SHOULD REFERENCE WITHIN. ORDINANCES AND MAYBE LIKE SOMETHING TO ADD TO IT, JUST IN CASE THAT CHANGES OVER THE YEARS. I DIDN'T EVEN HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THE VINYL WINDOWS. BUT IF WE'RE GOING TO DO VINYL, IT'S AT LEAST THE CRAFTSMAN STYLE VINYL. I MEAN, THERE WAS NO ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENTS AROUND THOSE WINDOWS TO MAKE THEM LOOK LIKE A CRAFTSMAN AT ALL. I DON'T KNOW, BECAUSE MY BRAIN IS ALREADY GONE SOUTH.ENCOURAGE DISCOURAGE. OKAY AND THEN I ASKED ABOUT THE HOW LETTER OF THE LETTER FROM A STRUCTURAL ENGINEERS REQUIRED WHEN I ASKED YOU THAT QUESTION BY EMAIL. I HAVE COURSE NEVER WANT TO MAKE SOMEBODY SPEND MORE MONEY THAN THEY NEED TO FOR SOMETHING THAT'S NOT NECESSARY.
BUT THIS SAYS I'M REALLY ONE FOR FOLLOWING THE LETTER OF WHAT THINGS SAY PRIOR TO DEMOLITION, A STRUCTURE OF A STRUCTURE. A LETTER FROM A STRUCTURAL ENGINEER IS REQUIRED IS AND SHALL, TOO NEAR THE SAME. SO CAN WE THEN SAY PRIOR TO DEMOLITION OF A STRUCTURE. A LETTER FROM A STRUCTURAL ENGINEER IS REQUIRED. IF. THE PURPOSE OF DEMOLITION, OR THE REASON FOR DEMOLITION IS BECAUSE OF STRUCTURAL ISSUES AND YOU KNOW WHAT THE WORD MEANS TO BE. I THINK WHAT WOULD. MAYBE BETTER DO IT IS KIND OF HOW WE DO THE RIGHT AWAY ABANDONMENT. WE CAN JUST STATE PRIOR TO DEMOLITION OF A STRUCTURE LETTER FROM THE STRUCTURAL ENGINEERS REQUIRED UNLESS WAIVED BY THE COMMISSION OR COUNCIL AND THAT WAY WHEN THEY BRING THE PROJECT TO YOU. PART OF THAT REQUEST IS ALSO TO WAIT NOW WHAT THAT DOES TO THE APPLICANT IS YOU KNOW THEY CAN COME AND SAY LIKE, FOR INSTANCE, TONIGHT, SAY THE ADCS THAT WELL, YOU KNOW, IT'S THERE'S NO STRUCTURAL DAMAGE, SO WE'RE NOT PROVIDING A STRUCTURAL NOW THE BOARD CAN SAY. OKAY WE HEAR WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. BUT NO, WE WANT A STRUCTURAL NOW THAT JUST WOULDN'T REQUIRE THAT APPLICATION. TO BE TABLED AND, YOU KNOW WHAT IT IS, BUT I THINK MAYBE JUST ADDING THAT LANGUAGE TO CLEARLY SAY UNLESS WAIVED BY THE COMMISSION. BUT DOESN'T THAT JUST PICK UP MORE TIME? I MEAN, I MEAN, I GET A PACKET. AND BECAUSE MY ORDINANCES I NEED THOSE STRUCTURAL ENGINEERS REPORT. I MEAN, RENE JUST SAY IS IMPORTANT IN RENEE'S EMAILED ME BACK. OKAY SO WE JUST SAY, BUT IF WHAT DID YOU SAY? IF REASON FOR DEMOLITION IS STRUCTURALLY BASED. IF YOUR WARNING TO DEMOLISH BECAUSE IT'S STRUCTURALLY UNSOUND. I DON'T I MEAN UNINHABITABLE OR DANGEROUS TO SOMEBODY LIVING THERE WILL SAY I DISAGREE, THOUGH, BECAUSE I DON'T I DON'T GET WHAT THE DIFFERENCE IS WHAT YOU'RE SAYING AND I GET WHAT IT IS. BUT I LIKE CHINESE VERSION BETTER BECAUSE I THINK IF WE LIKE IT WILL THE PACKET WOULD STATE LIKE, WHAT'S THE REASON LIKE THEY JUST WANT, YOU KNOW, LIKE THEY'RE THERE.
THEY JUST WANT TO KNOCK IT DOWN BECAUSE THEY WANT TO REDEVELOP IT. THEN WE KNOW IT'S NOT. IT'S LIKE WE KNOW ALREADY. IT'S NOT STRUCTURAL PROBLEMS, SO THE DIFFERENCE WAS SO THEN, MAYBE THE PACKAGE TO STATE THAT IF THERE'S NOT A STRUCTURAL REASON FOR TEAR DOWN NOTE, THERE IS NO STRUCTURAL ENGINEERS REPORT BECAUSE THIS IS NOT FAR NOT STRUCTURAL. AH AND THEN I WOULD NEVER TAKEN MY TIME TO. YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T TAKE YOUR TIME AND SAID THAT IT WAS YEAH, IF YOU READ IF YOU READ THE THREE FROM TODAY, THEY SAY IN THERE THAT IT WAS INFRASTRUCTURAL REASONS. IT WAS IN THE REPORT AND THAT IN THE PACKET I WAS JUST GOING TO SAY BUT I THINK FOR ME WORKING IN THE LEGAL FIELD, I WOULD LIKE IT TO SAY. IT'S FOR REDEVELOPMENT, SO NO YEAH, SO TO ME BECAUSE I'M VERY LITERAL, SO I'M LIKE, OK, DONE. YEAH OKAY, THAT'S FINE WITH ME.
I DON'T. OKAY HOW ABOUT THE. PAGE 150. I THINK IT'S 150 OF YOURS. MHM. SO A BIG ISSUE ON
[01:25:21]
THIS APPLICANTS. HOUSE WAS THE FACT THAT THE GARAGE WAS NOT A SEPARATE STRUCTURE. AND COMMENTS WERE WELL, THE LOT IS SO SMALL, THERE'S NOT ENOUGH ROOM. SO. IS THIS WORDED BECAUSE WHEN IT GETS INTO ALL THE BURBAGE ABOUT 10 FT FROM THIS AND 5 FT. FROM THIS, I NEED A VISUAL OF HOW THAT IS GOING TO SIT ON THE LOT. I WOULD RATHER GIVE UP YARD SO THAT I HAVE CAN BE ACCURATE. HOUSE AND A SEPARATE. AND LET THEM HAVE LESS YARD THAN TO COMPLY WITH 10 FT. FROM THIS AND 5 FT. FROM THIS AND 4 FT FROM THIS AND OFFSET DIFFERENCE. HOW DO WE HOW DO WE DO THAT? BECAUSE IT SOUNDS LIKE THE WAY IT'S WORDED NOW. REASON THESE PEOPLE COULDN'T HAVE THIS PART OF THE REASON WHY THESE PEOPLE COULDN'T HAVE THIS HOUSE WITH A SEPARATE GARAGES BECAUSE THERE WAS NO ROOM ON THE LAP BECAUSE THE WAY IT HAD TO BE SET BECAUSE OF THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE YARD. SO EDUCATE ME ON THAT BUILD SETBACK. LINES WERE INTEGRAL. UM STILL AND CHANGE THAT. I DON'T KNOW. THEY. FULL ANSWER TO THAT BECAUSE I WAS ON THE IMPRESSION THAT IT WASN'T ABOUT THE LOT SIZE OR SETBACKS FOR THE GARAGE. IT WAS PREFERENCE OF THE HOMEOWNERS THEY WANTED. ATTACHED GARAGE.WELL BUT WHEN THE DISCUSSION CAME TO THE DETACHED GARAGE, IT WAS THAT THE LOT WASN'T BIG ENOUGH FOR AN ATTACHED GARAGE WHEN YOU LOOKED AT THE LOT AND THE WAY OUT OF THE HOUSE AND THE SETBACKS THERE, YOU COULDN'T PHYSICALLY PUT A GARAGE. ON THE WHAT SEPARATE FROM THE HOUSE.
THE ONLY WAY TO PUT A GARAGE. ON THAT PIECE OF PROPERTY WOULD BE AN ATTACHED GARAGE. WAS THAT THOUGH BECAUSE WE HAD TO GIVE SO MANY FEET HERE, AND THEREFORE THE YARD AND ALL THAT THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND WAS THAT THE REASON THAT THEY WERE SAYING THAT THERE WASN'T A ENOUGH ROPE TO DETECT, SO IF THAT WAS THE CASE AND LET'S SAY THE ONLY ELEMENT THAT THAT I DIDN'T WANT TO APPROVE ON THIS HOUSE WAS BECAUSE IT HAD A DETACHED GARAGE AND ATTACHMENT.
IF WE HAD COULD WE HAVE GIVEN UP SOME YARD PLACE THAT HOUSE IN A WAY WHERE THERE COULD HAVE BEEN A DETACHED GARAGE, AND THAT WOULD HAVE ANSWERED THE QUESTION. NO NOT FOR ME, BUT I MEAN, WOULD THAT HAVE SOLVED THE PROBLEM WITH US WANTING A DETACHED GARAGE ON A CRAFTSMAN? WHAT'S THE PRIORITY DETACHED GARAGE OR ALL OF THE BILL? LYING FOOTAGE REQUIREMENTS. YOU KNOW, THIS CAN'T BE TOO CLOSE TO THAT. SOMEONE INSIDE THE PREFERENCE. WHAT ISN'T THE PRIORITY AND BUILDING A ARCHITECTURALLY HISTORICALLY HOUSE OR IS IT GIVEN A MINUTE, THE YARD THAT THEY WANT. I'M BUT ALL THAT'S PART OF THE ORDINANCE AND I AT I THINK, LIKE EAT A SAYING WHICH PRESIDENT BACK TO YOUR VARIANCES WHICH VARIANCES ARE MOST IMPORTANT AND YOU KNOW, THAT'S JUST A DISCUSSION OF THIS BOARD. WOULD I WAS THINKING ABOUT BECAUSE I THINK IT WAS A FOUR BEDROOM HOUSE, RIGHT? THE FACT THAT TO ME THAT IS A VERY LARGE HOUSE TO PUT THERE WITH OR WITHOUT A GARAGE. AND SO I WAS THINKING, LIKE, THEORETICALLY, BASED ON ALL THESE LINES THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HOW BIG OF A HOUSE COULD YOU BUILD THERE? DO YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN? BECAUSE, LIKE I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY, THIS WAS UP TO THEM. BUT LIKE, WHY NOT A THREE BEDROOM OR EVEN A TWO BEDROOM? BUT I FEEL LIKE IT WAS SO FOR ME. IT'S HARD TO BE LIKE ON THAT. YES SO FOR ME, IT'S MORE ABOUT LIKE, WHY ARE WE TRYING TO PUT A FOUR BEDROOM HOUSE ON THIS SPACE? AND WHY DOESN'T IT BE TWO BEDROOM OR THREE BEDROOM? YOU KNOW, I'LL ALWAYS I KNOW THAT'S UP TO THE APPLICANT, BUT I FEEL LIKE I DON'T I THINK THAT WE SHOULD I MEAN, NECESSARILY. THE APPLICANTS SHOULD HAVE TO GET TO MAXIMIZE THEIR SPACE JUST BECAUSE THEY WANT TO, REGARDLESS OF BUT THE GARAGE BEING ATTACHED OR WHATNOT. I MEAN, AGAIN. I FEEL LIKE I KEEP COMING BACK TO ARE WE BUILDING IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT? ARE WE BUILDING IN A SUBDIVISION SOMEWHERE? NONE OF THESE QUESTIONS WOULD BE AN ISSUE FOR ME IF WE WERE BUILDING SOMEPLACE ELSE. THAT THE PURPOSE FOR BUILDING IN THE HISTORIC DESSERT DISTRICT WAS TO CREATE MORE HISTORICALLY ACCURATE
[01:30:04]
STRUCTURES SO THAT WE COULD THEN ADD THOSE TWO HISTORICAL RECORDS AND HOUSES AND BUILDINGS AS THEY GROW OLDER. IF THAT'S NOT THE PURPOSE. I'M NOT ON THIS BOARD. THE HISTORIC HISTORY. I THOUGHT THAT WAS OUR PURPOSE. YOUR PRIMARY PURPOSE IS TO PRESERVE PRESERVATION. BUT YOU CAN'T PRESERVE WHAT YOU DON'T HAVE. AND THAT'S BEEN THE MOST HAVE YOUR THIS HOUSE. THE LAST HOUSE THAT HOUSES THAT HAVE COME THROUGH HERE IN THE LAST FIVE YEARS OR NOT HISTORIC. THEY ARE NOT TRUE HISTORIC HOMES. BETTER. AND FOR YOU TO BUILD THEM IN 2023. BY THE TIME THEY ARE HISTORIC. NONE OF US KNOW WHAT THOSE RULES ARE GOING TO BE. AND I DON'T THINK YOU'RE GONNA BUILD EVEN IF YOU BUILD A TRUE TO THE LETTER TO THE T CRAFTSMAN HOME TODAY. IT IS NOT GOING TO BE REGISTERED AS A HISTORICAL. RIGHT I AGREE, BUT I LIKE THINKING BACK TO THIS HOUSE LIKE, I THINK, LET'S SAY SHE MADE A TWO BEDROOM. YEAH AND IT'S OBVIOUSLY A SMALLER HOUSE.THEN YOU CAN PUT A DETACHED GARAGE AND HAVE LIKE THE PORCH LIKE BASICALLY FOLLOWING MORE OF THE ORDINANCE I FEEL YET IT'S NOT LIKE A BIG, HUGE HOME THAT YOU COULD BUILD A SUBDIVISION.
BUT THEN THAT TO ME MORE APPROPRIATELY FITS THAT SPACE. SO THAT'S WHY I LIKE EVEN IF WE'RE NOT TRYING TO MAKE IT EXACTLY HOW IT WAS LIKE TRYING TO FIT AS MANY ARE GO BY AS MANY OF THE ORDINANCES THAT WE'VE SET. YEAH. I FEEL LIKE THAT JUST KIND OF COMES BACK TO THE OVERSTEPPING THOUGH, RIGHT? LIKE HOW CAN WE TELL SOMEBODY YOU HAVE TO HAVE A THREE BEDROOM HOUSE INSTEAD OF A FOUR BEDROOM HOUSE? IF THERE'S CERTAIN THINGS THAT THEY'RE DOING THAT DOES MEET. A GENERAL IDEA OF WHAT THE HOUSE SHOULD BE RIGHT. BUT WE CAN'T GO BACK AND TELL THEM LIKE YOU HAVE TO BUILD A TWO BEDROOM HOUSE SO THAT YOU MEET EVERY SINGLE ORDINANCE SO THAT WE'RE HAPPY. RIGHT? RIGHT AND I AGREE. THAT'S NOT WHAT I'M SAYING. I'M SAYING MORE LIKE SHE WANTS ABOUT A FOUR BEDROOM HOME, WHICH TO ME, THAT'S NOT AS DOABLE IN THE STORY DISTRICT SO THEN, TO ME THAT LENDS ITSELF MORE TO A LARGER PIECE OF PROPERTY SOMEWHERE ELSE BECAUSE I FEEL LIKE WHAT SHE DID IS GOT THAT LAND AND WANTED TO BUILD WHATEVER HOUSE SHE WANTED TO BUILD, REGARDLESS OF THE ORDINANCES VERSUS TRYING TO WORK WITH THE LAND AND, WELL, I CAN'T HAVE ALL THESE THINGS THAT I WANT, BUT I CAN STILL BUILD, YOU KNOW, A NICE HOME. AND TO ME, THAT'S MORE ABOUT WHAT IT IS THAT SHE TRIED TO MAXIMIZE. THIS HOUSE AND DIDN'T MEET ANY OF OUR ORDINANCES. OUR LARGE AMOUNT OF THEM. AND SO, YEAH, I DON'T THINK I WOULDN'T SAY YOU CAN ONLY BUILD LIKE A TWO BEDROOM, BUT I THINK YOU CAN WORK WITH THE LOT THAT YOU HAVE AND FOLLOW. MORE OF THE ORDINANCES THINK THIS SIZE OF THAT LOT WAS SUCH THAT WELL, WELL. A TWO CAR GARAGE. ONE CAR GARAGE IS GOING TO BE THAT 100 SQUARE FEET 10 BY 10. A TWO CAR GARAGE IS GONNA BE ABOUT 200 SQUARE FEET 20 BY 10. SO 200 SQUARE FEET IS EQUIVALENT OVER THERE. 11 CAR GARAGE IS 10 BY 20. SO IT'S 200 SQUARE FEET OF TWO CAR GARAGES. 20 BY 20, WHICH IS 400.
NO. OKAY YOU'RE RIGHT. YOU ARE RIGHT. YOU ARE RIGHT. SORRY. UM YES, IT WAS 404 100 SQUARE FEET, SO THAT'S EQUIVALENT TO FOUR BEDROOMS. IF THE BEDROOMS WERE 10 BY 10. AND MANY BEDROOMS IN TODAY'S HOMES ARE 10 BY 10. UM, SO I MEAN THAT I DON'T SEE THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN EVEN VIABLE ON THAT LOT IN ANY WAY. WELL AND MAYBE NOT, BUT I THINK THAT JUST BECAUSE SOMEONE WANTS TO BUILD A HOUSE THERE AND THAT THAT THE WAY THEY WANT TO DOESN'T MEAN THAT WE HAVE TO APPROVE IT.
SOMEONE COULD COME ALONG LATER AND DO SOMETHING DIFFERENT. THAT'S A BETTER FIT, AND IT'S KIND OF WATER UNDER THE BRIDGE. BUT YOU KNOW, WE COULD HAVE JUST SAID YEAH. YOU CAN'T HAVE A GARAGE. BECAUSE THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN ALTERNATIVE WOULD BE NO GARAGE. THAT WAS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE TALKED ABOUT THAT. OH, AND THERE WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN ANOTHER AREA FOR THEM TO PARK LIKE THAT. THAT WAS KIND OF THE OTHER ISSUE. WHAT WAS THE IDEA ISSUE? I DIDN'T HEAR THAT.
THAT IF WE TOOK AWAY THE GARAGE THERE, WHERE WOULD THEY PARK? RIGHT BECAUSE IT'S NOT LIKE THERE WAS EXTRA SPACE TRAVELING. THE DRIVEWAY PARKED IN MY DRIVEWAY. I DON'T HAVE A GARAGE.
[01:35:03]
CAN. CAN I BUY A PIECE OF PROPERTY? IS IT NOT YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO FIGURE OUT EITHER BEFORE YOU BUY HER AFTER YOU GUYS WHAT YOU ARE ABLE TO PUT ON IT. OR OR IS IT APPROPRIATE FOR YOU TO THINK YOU'RE GOING TO BUY IT AND INCOMES STRONGARM EVERYBODY TO GET WHAT YOU WANT, AND THEN I'M SUPPOSED TO FEEL BAD BECAUSE I SAY NO. NO, I'M NOT GONNA FEEL BAD. SO GETTING BACK TO THE ISSUE ORIGINALLY AT HAND. PART OF THE SETBACK THING. UM, MISS STONE, IS THAT THE ORDINANCE, AS SHALL AGAIN WHEN IT COMES TO THE SETBACKS. SO IF THIS BOARD WANTS LEEWAY ON SETBACKS DOWNTOWN IN ORDER TO MAKE SURE THAT THE BUILDINGS OR YOU KNOW, STRUCTURES THAT ARE BUILT OR MORE OF THE HISTORICAL NATURE. THEN THAT'S WHAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED. AND THAT'S MY QUESTION. THAT WAS MY QUESTION. HONESTLY, WAS IS THAT SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO LOOK AT AND CHANGING SO THAT WE CAN MAKE SURE BECAUSE ALL OF THESE LITTLE LOTS THAT ARE LAST ARE SMALL LITTLE LOT. I CAN PROMISE YOU. NONE OF THESE LOTS ARE ANY BIGGER THAN THE WONDERFUL IS IN QUESTION RIGHT NOW. SO THEREFORE WE'RE GOING TO HAVE THIS ISSUE EVERY TIME SOMEBODY WANTS TO BUILD ON ONE OF THESE LITTLE LIFE. AND WHATEVER WE APPROVE ON THIS ONE. IT'S THEY'RE GOING TO SLAP US IN THE FACES. AND ALL THESE OTHER LOTS THAT COME AFTER IT. WHERE YOU LOOK WHAT YOU DO. WELL AGAIN, MISS ALI POINTED OUT EARLIER. IT'S UP TO YOU TEMPERATURE OF Y'ALL. I MEAN, WE CAN MAKE SOME RECOMMENDATIONS ON . I MEAN, YOU CAN PUSH HOUSES CLOSER TO THE STREET. THAT'S FINE, YOU KNOW AND HAVE A HAVE A LESS OF A SETBACK. UM MY HOUSE I GREW UP IN, UM, WAS LITERALLY THERE WAS 4 FT. SIDEWALK OFF IN THEIR DIAL SAT RIGHT THERE, AND IT WAS ALSO BUILT IN 1840 SOMETHING I MEAN, SQUARE NAILS. YOU KNOW THEY WERE AND SO BUT MY POINT IS, IS THAT YEAH. WITHIN CERTAIN REASON. NOW I'M GOING TO GET YOU KNOW IF THAT'S THE DIRECTION THEN YOU KNOW, MISS ALI AND I WILL TALK TO LIKE THE FIRE DEPARTMENT AND ENGINEERING BECAUSE THERE'S LIKE VISIBILITY TRIANGLES AND, YOU KNOW SETBACKS THAT FIRE DEPARTMENT'S GOING TO WANT THAT, BUT WE DEFINITELY CAN LOOK AT IT INSTEAD OF SAYING SHALL ON SETBACKS. THERE CAN BE RECOMMENDATIONS AND THEN THOSE CAN BE ANOTHER VARIANTS. THAT SOMEBODY MAY NEED IN ORDER AND IN ORDER TO UM, MEET CERTAIN REQUIREMENTS FOR WHETHER IT'S LIVING SPACE OR WHETHER IT'S UM ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENTS WOULD I WANT TO KNOW? IS IT OR WOULD IT BE POSSIBLE? BASED ON THE SETBACKS THAT WE HAVE TO SEE. LIKE SO WE HAVE THE LOT SIZE AND THEN, LIKE THE SIZE OF THE HOUSE THAT SOMEONE WOULD BE ABLE TO BUILD, BUILD, BECAUSE I WANT TO KNOW IS IT? I MEAN, BECAUSE BASED ON THIS LAW, IS IT POSSIBLE? 1200 SQUARE FOOT HOUSE ON IT. WE'LL JUST BECAUSE I WANT TO SEE IF IT IS IT POSSIBLE AND IF YOU GET TO THE POINT WHERE IT'S LIKE, OH, THERE'S NOT POSSIBLE TO HAVE A HOUSE OR REALLY ANYTHING PRACTICAL. THEN I THINK IT WOULD BE A DIFFERENT DISCUSSION FOR THAT LOT GOING FORWARD, YOU KNOW, AND THEN MAYBE WE WOULD BE MORE OKAY WITH THAT THAT HOUSE BUT I MEAN, IT'S WHAT IS IT POSSIBLE TO SEE WHAT USABLE AREA WE HAVE TO BUILD ON FOR THAT LOT? YES, I MEAN, THAT'S. THAT'S WHAT YOUR SITE PLAN IS WHEN THAT SITE PLAN IS PRESENTED TO YOU. IT SHOWS YOU THE LOT SHOWS YOU HOW FAR THE FRONT SETBACK IS AND WHAT SIZE STRUCTURE THAT IS, UM HMM. ALSO FOR THIS ONE, THOUGH, THIS WE HAD WE HAD TALKED ABOUT THAT IN THE LAST MEETING THAT THIS HOUSE WAS MAXED OUT. THAT WAS IT. WE TOOK IT RIGHT TO THE EDGE OF WHERE THEY CAN TAKE IT. EXCEPT IT HAD AN ATTACHMENT. SO LET'S GO TO THE ATTACHED ACCESSORY BUILDING SECTION. EXCESS ACCESSORIES STRUCTURES. I THINK STRUCTURE NEEDS TO BE TAKEN OUT AND USES NEED TO BE PUT IN ACCESSORY USAGE. THE GARAGE IS AN ACCESSORY USE. I THINK IT SOUNDS LIKE WE JUST NEED TO CLARIFY WHAT LIVING QUARTERS. IT'S NOT EXCESSIVE. IT. WHAT? GO AHEAD. I HATE TO KEEP BEATING UP MISS STONE ON PROBATIVE, BUT USE BY THE ORDINANCE IS UM. HOW A PARTICULAR PIECE OF LAND. IS THERE. THERE'S A VERY SPECIFIC DEFINITION WHEN IT COMES TO USE, UM AND A GARAGE IS. FOR A SINGLE FAMILY HOME. IT IS PART OF THE SINGLE FAMILY USE SO WE CAN'T[01:40:09]
USE THE WORD USE AND. I HATE TO KEEP POOP POOP ON YOUR PARADE ON WORDS. BUT NO, THAT'S OKAY. THAT WORD WAS GIVEN TO ME BY SOMEBODY ELSE. YEAH, THIS ONE. BECAUSE STRUCTURE. SEEMED TO MEAN THAT IF YOU STUCK THAT GARAGE AS INTO THAT HOUSE THEN IT MEANS IT'S A PART OF THAT HOUSE. EXCEPT THAT.IT SAYS THAT A GARAGE IS AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. I THINK THE WORD IF YOU WANT TO TAKE A WORD OUT, IT SHALL BE LOCATED IN A SEPARATE BUILDING, BUT IT DOES SUCH AS THEN IT'S NOT AN ACCESSORY. SUCH AS IS THE REALLY IMPORTANT PART OF THAT SENTENCE, THOUGH, OKAY THEN, BUT GARAGES COME ON, GUYS. GARAGES ARE NOT. WOW I THINK FOR ME. PART OF THIS PROBLEM IS THE FACT THAT GARAGES , SHEDS AND GREENHOUSES AND ETCETERA WILL SHOVED TOGETHER. SO LIKE MAYBE IF YOU MAKE THE ARGUMENT THAT YOU NEED A GARAGE FOR HOUSE, YOU DON'T NEED A GREENHOUSE. AND YOU DON'T NEED A SHED, BUT YOU'VE LUMPED THEM TOGETHER. SO IT READS YOU. IF YOU'RE READING THAT WAY, I READ IT THAT THESE ARE ALL ACCESSORIES BECAUSE TO ME ALL YOU NEED ARE LIKE BEDROOMS, A KITCHEN, A BATHROOM, THAT KIND OF THING. SO I THINK IF WE WANTED TO BE CLEAR, WE'D HAVE TO SEPARATE THOSE OUT. MY THOUGHT. I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S ME AND HOW I INTERPRET IT. BUT TO ME. AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE IS A STRUCTURE THAT IS NOT ATTACHED TO THE HOUSE, WHICH COULD BE A GARAGE A GREENHOUSE, A SHAD PERTINENT STRUCTURE. OR ANY OF THE OTHERS, BUT AN ACCESSORY IS DETACHED AND NO MATTER WHAT IT IS. AND I DON'T READ THIS AS SAYING THAT A GARAGE ATTACHED GARAGE IS AN ACCESSORY. ONLY A DETACHED GARAGE. THAT'S AN ACCESSORY, OKAY? I HEAR YOU. I'M GONNA GO RIGHT BACK TO IN A SUBDIVISION OR IN WEEKEND. ARE WE IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT? AND ARE WE BUILDING HISTORICALLY ACCURATE HOMES? ARE WE BUILDING JUST MODERN STRUCTURE EVERY HISTORIC HOME. YEAH. SO NO HISTORIC HOME HAS AN ATTACHED GARAGE. SHOW ME ACROSS AND WITHIN, PATRICK DIDN'T SAY CRAFTSMAN. I SAID HISTORIC A ATTACHED GIRLS AREN'T THE ONLY TWO STORY. MHM ROWHOUSE DOESN'T HAVE A ATTACHED GARAGE ACTUALLY OWNED THE VICTORIAN HOUSE, THE HEAD OF THE TEXT GARAGE. WHEN WAS IT BUILT 1902? WHERE WAS IT BUILT STONE. NEVER SEEN. I'M GOING TO BRING UP THE POINT THAT NEEDED, DID I? WHAT I DON'T LIKE IS THAT IF SOMETHING IS PRESENTED, AND THEY'VE ATTACHED IT TO THE HOUSE, IT'S NO LONGER AN ACCESSORY BUILDING BECAUSE THEY COULD ATTACH LITERALLY ALMOST ANYTHING AT THAT POINT AND BE LIKE THAT'S NOT ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. SO TO ME, THAT IS WHAT I DON'T LIKE. SO BECAUSE I MEAN, I'M JUST THINKING OF WHO KNOWS WHAT THEY WOULD ATTACH. YEAH WE DON'T WANT WE DON'T WANT PEOPLE CLAIMING, YOU KNOW. WELL, I WANT A STORAGE BUILDING. AND ATTACHING A STORAGE BUILDING A SHED ESSENTIALLY TO THE HOUSE, RIGHT? THE GARAGE IS NOT REALLY ALTHOUGH A LOT OF PEOPLE USE IT FOR STORAGE BUILDING IT SHOULDN'T BE AND IT'S NOT WHAT IT'S INTENDED TO BE. SO IS THE ANSWER HERE THEN TO SAY SOMETHING LIKE ACCESSORY STRUCTURES. UM COULD INCLUDE GARAGES SHEDS GREENHOUSES. WE NEED TO ADD A COMMA, ETCETERA. BECAUSE THEN WE'RE SAYING A GARAGES AND ACCESSORY STRUCTURE.
IT'S NOT HEARD OF THE HOUSE, RIGHT? YOU HAVE A VALID POINT BECAUSE LIKE JASON AND I ALL THESE YEARS WE WRITE THESE ORDINANCES. TRUTH BE TOLD. ORDINANCES AREN'T WRITTEN FOR THE PERSON THAT THINKS COMMONLY AND GENERALLY. BECAUSE, LIKE YOU SAID, IN OUR MINDS WERE THINKING. NOBODY'S GOING TO ATTACH THEIR GREENHOUSE TO THEIR HOUSE JUST TO SAY IT'S NOT AN ACCESSORY. BUT SOMEBODY WILL SOMEBODY WILL SO YOU KNOW? YEAH MAYBE WE NEED TO CLEAN THIS UP A LITTLE BIT FOR THAT ONE PERSON. YEAH, AND I LIKE I MEAN, SO I KNOW SANDRA. I THINK WANTS TO GO TO MORE STRICT ROUTE, BUT I KIND OF LIKE REMOVING SOME ITEMS. THAT GIVES US MORE LEEWAY. MAYBE
[01:45:07]
SOMETIMES WE'RE OKAY WITH AN ATTACHED GARAGE AND THAT LIKE HIS OLD HOUSE, FOR EXAMPLE, AND SOMETIMES WE'RE NOT, YOU KNOW, SO I THINK WE? YEAH LIKE SHE'S SAYING, SAY SOMETHING. I DON'T KNOW SOMETHING ELSE. MAKE IT CLEAR THAT JUST BECAUSE YOU'VE ATTACHED IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT IT'S ATTACHED AND THEN WE IT'S UP TO US WHETHER WE WANT TO PROVE IT.AT THIS TIME WE'LL GO OUT OF THE WORK SESSION. AND WE'LL RECONVENE INTO BACK INTO REGULAR SESSION. I DON'T THINK WE NEED AN EXECUTIVE SESSION. THAT'S WHAT IT SAYS EXECUTIVE SESSION.
UM I'LL TAKE A MOTION TO ADJOURN. UNLESS THERE'S ANY OTHER COMMENTS, QUESTIONS. I MAKE A MOTION TO ADJOURN. SECOND . CAST YOUR VOTE. MOTION CARRIED .
* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.